Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Jeremy Good
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Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Jeremy Good » Fri Jul 13, 2018 10:57 am

Has anyone had a look at these locos yet with a view to a P4 conversion?

They seem to have been quite well received but I can't track down any information on whether the drive-train is a traditional one or more like the DJ Models Well Tank and 02. If more conversion, friendly what is the axle diameter?

Thanks

Jeremy

Philip Hall
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Philip Hall » Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:51 pm

I haven’t seen one close up yet, but if it’s a conventional drive train there is hope. More of a problem is that no one makes the correct wheel for this engine anymore, and it’s very distinctive. Sharman did, but there is no hope there now. So it might be a case of taking the existing wheels, turning off the tyres and putting on some new P4 ones. Possibly turning the existing tyres down might work, but maybe at some cost to the appearance of the front of the wheels, and not a job I would relish, knowing my limitations...

Probably why I will not be at all keen to try a conversion!

Philip

Andrew Ullyott
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Andrew Ullyott » Fri Jul 13, 2018 9:29 pm

Not on this occasion. I've a SEFinecast one todo. Amazingly the RTR model came out before I built the kit! It's usually the other way round...

Jeremy Good
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Jeremy Good » Sat Jul 14, 2018 9:37 am

Thanks Philip and Andrew.

From what pictures I could find I suspect that the chassis is a little more complex than ideal for a simple conversion.

However, I discovered yesterday that DCC Supplies have some complete body shells available albeit in LSWR rather than BR livery at the rather attractive price of £24 each. One is now en-route (Caen) together with a SE Finecast chassis kit (£36). It looks like I might be able to create a P4 version for about the same price as the RTR original....

Progress with this plan may appear here over the next week or so.

Jeremy

David Knight
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby David Knight » Sat Jul 14, 2018 12:58 pm

Jeremy,

The SEF chassis option is the same one I have chosen for my SECR P class. However, you may find you have to take a bit “off the top” as the frames are about 1mm too deep. This will also entail adjusting the etched slots for the cross pieces as needed. Not an onerous task, just a fussy one and best started before anything gets soldered up. I would post pics but am in the middle of a house move so...

Cheers,

David

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Re6/6
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Re6/6 » Sat Jul 14, 2018 4:51 pm

Jeremy,

Another useful part from DCC supplies is the cylinder assembly. https://www.dccsupplies.com/item-p-1131 ... art-18.htm

Gibson do a set of mainframes. LM1 - 201 LSWR B4 0-4-0T

That's the route that l will be going!
John

Philip Hall
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Philip Hall » Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:46 pm

Gents,

All these roads to an end using the Dapol body are OK but the wheels are distinctive and not available from any source. Nothing really comes close. I have been thinking and I seem to remember that one of my customers was thinking of building a B4 some while ago and did some extensive research to try and find a suitable wheel. Nothing in present ranges (in P4) could be found. In the end I converted a very nice kit built one from EM to P4 for him, and was contemplating having to turn off the tyres from the fitted Romford wheels and fit some new ones, but just in time he found some Sharman wheels on eBay or somewhere. If you were to find some Sharmans, and if they are EM, don't be put off, by simply thinning the flanges at the back of the wheel, those EM wheels become a perfectly serviceable P4.

Philip

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Re6/6
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Re6/6 » Sun Jul 15, 2018 7:07 am

Phil, '00' wheelsets are available https://www.dccsupplies.com/item-p-1130 ... art-11.htm. Have you had any experience of turning down Dapol wheels? I've succeeded with Bach wheels but failed miserably with Hornby ones which seemed to be made from a very 'hard' material.
John

Philip Hall
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Philip Hall » Sun Jul 15, 2018 11:05 am

Never tried it, John. The problem with these wheels is that the flange is in the wrong place to simply be able to turn down the tyre. It also depends on how the tyre is fitted to the centre, and whether it is locked onto the centre or just a push fit. I assume the centre is plastic? I remember an article in MRJ a few years ago where the writer (might have been Peter Cross) had reduced the width of some Hornby wheels for a 42XX from the front, and then reprofiled the flange, to give him an EM wheel about 2.2mm wide. Presumably the profile of the spokes could be cleaned up after this. So if the balance weights on the B4 wheel are moulded through the spokes that might be possible, and if spares for the model are readily available then if you wreck a wheel all is not lost.

Obviously new axles would be needed, and this assumes that the chassis design is conventional. I think my preference would be to fit new tyres.

Philip

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Re6/6
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Re6/6 » Sun Jul 15, 2018 4:31 pm

Many thanks Phil.

I need some other Dapol spares so I'll tack on a pair of wheelsets and have a look at them closely. I'll report back in due course.
John

Jeremy Good
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Jeremy Good » Sun Jul 15, 2018 4:40 pm

John,

I’d be interested to hear how you get on. I did dig out Paul Bernsten’s MRJ article on making these wheels (MRJ35) but think that’s beyond me for now...

Does anyone know where there is a decent drawing for these locomotives that I can easily access?

Jeremy

Andrew Ullyott
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Andrew Ullyott » Sun Jul 15, 2018 5:08 pm

Don't know if its decent, but there's a drawing in the Russell book. I'll PM you.

Jeremy Good
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Jeremy Good » Mon Jul 16, 2018 9:18 am

Andrew,

That would be a great help, thanks.

Jeremy

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Simon_S
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Simon_S » Mon Jul 16, 2018 9:39 am

This post has links to changing the tyres on Heljan loco wheels and might provide some pointers for the Dapol conversion. I need to do something similar for the Heljan 07 shunter so will be interested in how you get on too.

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Horsetan
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Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Horsetan » Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:54 am

Fascinating. The spare bodies don't cover the dock tank can variant unless you buy the chassis with it, at a cost of £95.

As ever, it's the wheels that are the stumbling block, which just reminds us just how versatile the Sharman range was. So wide, in fact, that nobody would consider it viable nowadays to produce a new wheel for P4 use.
That would be an ecumenical matter.

Jeremy Good
Posts: 76
Joined: Fri Feb 19, 2010 10:36 pm

Re: Dapol LSWR B4 0-4-0T

Postby Jeremy Good » Thu Jul 19, 2018 4:54 pm

Thanks for the various comments and suggestions.

The spare body and extra parts (cylinders and sandboxes) arrived yesterday. There are only a couple of versions currently available as spares and this will eventually be painted into BR black, with the Linseed Oil filtration unit removed, but I quite liked it in this livery rather than the LSWR green.

IMG_1475.jpg
Dapol B4 "Caen" body


The SE Finecast chassis kit has also arrived and I've started work on that. The chassis has so far been built as a rigid chassis but I will add horn blocks for compensation in due course once I've decided which way round to drive the loco. A test fit to the loco, albeit with the wrong wheels, showed that it fits reasonably well but with 3' 6" wheels rides a little low (approx 1mm). No modification to the chassis has been required and I suspect that the correct, or in my case nearly correct wheels, will deal with that ride height discrepancy.

IMG_1477.jpg
Dapol B4 - trial fit chassis


I bought some wheels for this from Alan Gibson himself a few years back (3' 8 die, 10-spoke) and whilst they are not 100% accurate I'm happy to make the best I can with them for a locomotive that is a stop-gap solution to a lack of motive power for a particular project. I might investigate some of the other suggestions made further later, or indeed have a closer look at the other available wheels to see if they can be made closer to prototype, but for now I am going to press ahead with what I have.

I'm waiting for a gearbox to arrive and some other parts that I hope will improve the chassis and will report further in due course.

Jeremy


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