Scaleforum 2019

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Rod Cameron
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Rod Cameron » Wed Oct 02, 2019 5:07 pm

Mike doesn't do forums, but he says "for the record, the answer is (1) I reckon I’ve seen pictures of fully fitted freights without brake vans in steam days and (2), more importantly, my SR bogie brake is still under construction".

It did have a tail lamp anyway ...
Rod

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Re6/6
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Re6/6 » Wed Oct 02, 2019 6:14 pm

Noel wrote:I saw the Q1 and ballast hoppers in the fiddle yard at Scaleforum, and assumed that the brake van had yet to be attached. I presume it's absence in the video is intentional, so was this a peculiarity of SR practice? I ask because I had always understood that a brake van was required for all main line trains, even fully fitted ones, as this is, until the unions agreed in, I think, 1968 that guards could ride in the rear cab of diesel or electric locos. [I am aware that local instructions could allow certain limited movements without a van in steam days, and civil engineers could do what they wanted in an occupation, but neither seem to apply here.]


I'm sorry that we seemed to have made a 'mistake' in your view. It could be that you're right but was it necessary to be critical over something rather insignificant in the overall scheme of things that could be incorrect or correct?
John

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Re6/6
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Re6/6 » Wed Oct 02, 2019 6:19 pm

Terry Bendall wrote:It is, and I would like to thank Rod and John and the rest of the team for bringing the layout to Scaleforum. It is I believe very much the work of two people which is quite amazing in itself. There were problems which I am sure were very frustrating after all the work that has been done and having been involved with three large layouts, but still nowhere near the size of Balcombe, I can appreciate the frustrations that this causes. The team deserve our thanks for having the courage to bring such a large undertaking to the exhibition.

Terry Bendall


Many thanks Terry for your kind words. They are very much appreciated. We did eventually enjoy ourselves when things got running properly. Being unable to easily set the thing up and this being the first public outing (not counting Crawley a few years ago and just the viaduct at S4um in 2013!) it took a while to get working properly. After all, enjoyment of our hobby is what we're about and providing entertainment for the paying attendees. We are not prototype perfect and probably never will be.

In 2010 the arrival of the arches cut for us in the then relatively new laser cutting process was the beginning of the thing. It then steadily progressed with the making the distinctive piers and all the under-support. The land contours were made using our skills in GRP boat repairs.
Things continued gradually over the intervening years with quite some disjointed progress when 'events' stopped us dead on several occasions. There things more important and serious in life than trainsets!

Anyway after two abortive attempts and disappointments for Terry due to the aforesaid 'events' we finally made it. We are probably 70% finished on the viaduct section but there's a long way to go on the station boards......contour corrections and not to mention 100+ trees for a start!

Finally, after this potted history, our intentions stock-wise are for two boat trains 1950s and 1960s (in different liveries) and the Raworth 'booster' locos. Also being built are the three types of fast six-car green electrics (6-PUL/6-PAN/6-CIT) along with some 4-CORs which did appear on the Central from time to time. We are blessed with the use of Mike Ainsworth's delightful stock for which we thank him.
John

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Noel
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Noel » Wed Oct 02, 2019 8:13 pm

Re6/6 wrote:I'm sorry that we seemed to have made a 'mistake' in your view. It could be that you're right but was it necessary to be critical over something rather insignificant in the overall scheme of things that could be incorrect or correct?


I haven't said that you are wrong; I just asked a question because I wanted to know what the answer was, with an explanation of the background to what I understood the situation was. If you are so insecure that you cannot cope with polite questions, I pity anyone who really is critical.
Regards
Noel

Rdunning
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Rdunning » Thu Oct 03, 2019 11:08 am

I also queried the lack of a brake van with one of the operators who explained that the train in question had been borrowed from a layout set in time after the requirement for brake vans on fitted freights had been dispensed with. I accepted this as a valid reason in view of the "work in progress" nature of the layout and the current shortage of appropriate stock.
It was a real pleasure to see such a large project, allegedly largely the work of only two people, coming to fruition so effectively. I especially enjoyed watching the trains I remember from my youth so beautifully portrayed here. Mike Ainsworth's "J" class 4-6-2T hauling a birdcage set was the highlight for me amongst the many other delights on display.
Thanks and congratulations to everyone involved in bringing "Ouse Valley/Balcombe" to the show.

Richard

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Rod Cameron
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Rod Cameron » Thu Oct 03, 2019 3:55 pm

Many thanks Richard. Mike's explanation is also quoted in one of my posts above. And I agree entirely about the J and Birdcage set!

Finally, another video which shows the tail lamp on the ballast train (and also the changing signal aspect as a bonus).

Rod

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Le Corbusier
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Le Corbusier » Thu Oct 03, 2019 4:04 pm

Rod,

I just wondered ... do you have any plans or thoughts for a back scene to the viaduct?
Tim Lee

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Rod Cameron
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Rod Cameron » Thu Oct 03, 2019 4:28 pm

Le Corbusier wrote:Rod,

I just wondered ... do you have any plans or thoughts for a back scene to the viaduct?


Absolutely Tim. Back in January we had a set up of just the viaduct to experiment with exactly that in mind. Apart from the height/size (and cost, and weight) that has to be considered, there is also the question of access and continuity round the layout, and exactly where the horizon goes. At ground level on the real thing you only see sky above the viaduct obviously, and the tree line is through the arches. But the 'normal' viewing level of the layout is higher, so it's a very moveable feast. At the time we had this:

IMG_2625.JPG
IMG_2625.JPG (158.72 KiB) Viewed 1548 times


We're also thinking about half-relief trees in front of the backscene to enhance the impression of depth, but like with so many things on the layout at this stage we ran out of time. There are some quite nice commercial products around, and a continuous vinyl sheet would be nice but the cost may be prohibitive.
Rod

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Le Corbusier
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Le Corbusier » Thu Oct 03, 2019 4:58 pm

I was vaguely thinking after my experiments with a chair at scaleforum whether one solution might be to design the back scene to be viewed from a seated position and set chairs around the model. Then when standing you can have a good nose around before taking a pew to fully enter the scene? That would mean as far as height and operation is concerned the back scene height could be kept lower whilst still having a sense of real scale at chair height.

Just some musings and maybe not at all what you want to do. ;)
Tim Lee

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Rod Cameron
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Rod Cameron » Thu Oct 03, 2019 5:24 pm

Haha, yes we thought of that too!

IMG_2633.JPG
IMG_2633.JPG (119.58 KiB) Viewed 1519 times


But it starts to add to the overall footprint a bit.

(I'm conscious that we are risking taking over the whole Scaleforum thread here, and we ought to move this to a dedicated topic).
Rod

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Re6/6
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Re6/6 » Thu Oct 03, 2019 7:31 pm

Rdunning wrote:Thanks and congratulations to everyone involved in bringing "Ouse Valley/Balcombe" to the show.
Richard


Thank you Richard for your kind comments. Much appreciated.

Le Corbusier wrote:Rod,

I just wondered ... do you have any plans or thoughts for a back scene to the viaduct?


Tim, as Rod has said we do indeed. Here is a snap of an experiment tried earlier which will most likely be the basis.
There are three layers here. It does work from a 'normal viewing' standing position and also from a seated position.

20190108_103810a.jpg
20190108_103810a.jpg (44.49 KiB) Viewed 1470 times
Last edited by Re6/6 on Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.
John

waveydavey
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby waveydavey » Thu Oct 03, 2019 7:58 pm

nberrington wrote:The track work on Clackmannan goods was astounding. Fantastic attention to detail.


Thanks for the kind words. I really enjoyed the planning of the track work and got carried away with the intricacies of 45’ rail on 9’ sleepers left over from Caledonian days, 60’ rail on 8’6” sleepers and post war austerity track with bullhead rail on concrete sleepers. Pointwork also got some variety with full and semi interlacing of sleepers as well as the more usual timbering. Sadly I couldn’t justify a section of flat bottomed track as it was unlikely to have been cascaded from the main lines by 1975.

I’d like to say a big thanks here to Terry, both for organising S4um over the last ten years and for the D&E layout challenge in 2008 which helped to convince me that I might be able to do this P4 lark.

Cheers

David
Modelling Clackmannanshire Railways in 1975
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kelly
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby kelly » Fri Oct 04, 2019 2:44 pm

Have processed the small amount of video footage and uploaded to YouTube now.

https://youtu.be/pQJbUFpkaLY

Below a selection of photos:

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Captain Kernow
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Captain Kernow » Fri Oct 04, 2019 3:09 pm

A few of Balcombe from me:
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Balcombe station approaches


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Probably my favourite view along the layout


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Details at Balcombe station (some scenic work is still to be completed)
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The down platform 'Gents', my own extremely small contribution!
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kelly
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby kelly » Fri Oct 04, 2019 5:27 pm

Not sure why some of my photos above are upside down or sideways. Helpfully (or otherwise), windows explorer seems to automatically rotate the thumbnails and so it is hard to tell which are rotated wrong.

The video will need reediting it seems, I didn't add the still photos correctly it seems (new software I'm still getting used to). Will edit and reupload a new video in place of the current one when I get a chance.
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grovenor-2685
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby grovenor-2685 » Fri Oct 04, 2019 8:31 pm

It seems some photos, especially from iPhones, can have orientation info built in. I have found that opening it in MS Paint, rotating if needed, then, whether rotated or not, doing a 'Save as' will allow the resulting files to be uploaded and displayed correctly.
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Martin Wynne
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Martin Wynne » Fri Oct 04, 2019 9:00 pm

grovenor-2685 wrote:It seems some photos, especially from iPhones, can have orientation info built in.

Yes the orientation is in the EXIF segment of the image file.

Browsers can rotate such images automatically if you include in the CSS:

Code: Select all

img
{
 image-orientation:from-image;
}

Or at least Firefox can. I just added the above to the F12 Developer settings on this page, and the images above all flipped round to their proper orientation:

Image_orientation.png
Image_orientation.png (32.16 KiB) Viewed 1196 times

Over to the webmaster.

cheers,

Martin.
40 years developing Templot. And counting ...

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Brian Harrap
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Brian Harrap » Sat Oct 05, 2019 3:14 pm

You know I suppose its a sign of my advancing years but I can't recall quite who I've spoken to about the disposal of Sentinel Street at S4um. I do recall a group of three or four gentlemen who showed an interest in buying the layout - if you are till interested and you offer still stands, please get in touch. If not, any other offers will be considered.

Regards,

Brian.
Last edited by Brian Harrap on Tue Oct 08, 2019 8:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Allan Goodwillie
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Allan Goodwillie » Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:09 pm

Thanks Kelly, :)

for posting your video, it lasts longer than I had to spend observing the layouts that were there as Burntisland has a lot of operating positions and most of us are on most of the time. I was unable to take any video myself as we make it a policy not to photograph or film our own layout during opening times, however I will post a couple of photographs here of the East Group setting up for the show.

DSC05733.JPG
Here is a view from the Wast end of the layout looking East. This end is the coal dock and has a working hoist and turntables, etc.


DSC05809.JPG
A stand back view taken to show all the new work put into the fascia panel, stage curtains and lighting rig built over the last three months to improve the presentation of the layout now it has reached its full length. It also included some pull up display boards to replace others that were showing their age.


DSC05810.JPG
The central area which includes the train ferry with a few members gathered around during testing, there is always much interest in the train ferry at shows - there is a certain fascination in it for all of us who take turns to operate it.


DSC05811.JPG
The view from the East end looking up towards the station.


As you can see there were plenty of smiles as all seemed to be working after much effort had been put into advancing the electrics over the summer. The lighting rig has had the effect of giving the layout a more even lighting than the spots that we had before - no shame to them, but we have had a policy of upgrading where we can. The layout is not yet complete as there are further plans to add to the engine shed area and perhaps adding other features.

I might post a few photographs of some of the areas upgraded for Scalefourum as I took about a hundred photographs in all - one of my jobs has been to keep a record of changes made and construction photographs as well as looking after our photographic archive.

As everyone has said, but I would like to thank Terry personally for his steady and sensible approach to Scalefourum and for all his and Mike's support of things Scottish over the years which is very well appreciated by all of us from up north. We have always been welcome at all the events run by the society and on our side we have always tried to give a good show at all times.

It was nice from my own point of view to see everyone working the layout, really enjoying being there and also enjoying one another's company - especially all the new members who have brought a new impetus to the Group, I hope that the others don't mind me mentioning Chris Gough who as our new Chairman has managed to get everyone working over the summer doing the work that has been needed and a huge amount of work there has been by about a dozen members all putting in a huge effort. It did remind me of how many friends have been involved with the construction of Burntisland over the years and how many have sadly passed on in recent years. So many have put all their modelling hours in to create the layout as well as wives and friends of the layout that have helped support us. If they were with us in spirit I hope they are proud of their achievement, the story of Burntisland will continue at least for a few years yet , but sadly the era of Terry's shows has come to an end, but he will always be welcome in our company.

Allan :)

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kelly
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby kelly » Sat Oct 05, 2019 9:07 pm

I unfortunately didn't get a chance to video Burtisland 1883, but when I saw it it impressed as it did the previous times I'd seen it at shows.
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David Thorpe
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby David Thorpe » Sat Oct 12, 2019 8:20 am

Rather late in the day, but I'd like to take this opportunity to say how much I enjoyed Scaleforum (my first visit since City University days, although I have of course been to Scalefour North on numerous occasions). Basically, everything was good - the layouts exceeded my expectations, the demonstrators were approachable and busy, the traders were as tempting (and wallet lightening) as ever, and above all everyone was so friendly. My special thanks go to Mick Bonwick whose advice on weathering and the necessary equipment to buy was invaluable, to Terry for challenging me to come as a steward (and for organising the whole thing!) and to the Society officers who made me so welcome in my new capacity. Notwithstanding what I may have said in the past about distances, it was well worth the trip - thanks everyone.

DT

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Flymo748
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Flymo748 » Sat Oct 12, 2019 9:16 am

David Thorpe wrote:Rather late in the day, but I'd like to take this opportunity to say how much I enjoyed Scaleforum (my first visit since City University days, although I have of course been to Scalefour North on numerous occasions). Basically, everything was good - the layouts exceeded my expectations, the demonstrators were approachable and busy, the traders were as tempting (and wallet lightening) as ever, and above all everyone was so friendly. My special thanks go to Mick Bonwick whose advice on weathering and the necessary equipment to buy was invaluable, to Terry for challenging me to come as a steward (and for organising the whole thing!) and to the Society officers who made me so welcome in my new capacity. Notwithstanding what I may have said in the past about distances, it was well worth the trip - thanks everyone.


David,

It was an absolute pleasure to have you alongside on the Society Stand. I hope that it was a varied, interesting and enjoyable experience for you.

Life on the Stand is never dull. You can get questions as varied as "what's this P4 thing then?" to "who deals with a minor incident in the car park?". All part of life's rich tapestry...

We'd gladly welcome you back on a future occasion, and perhaps you will have the opportunity to do something similar for the Society back home in Scotland.

Until next time...
Paul Willis
Deputy Chairman
Beware of Trains - occasional modelling in progress!
www.5522models.co.uk

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Allan Goodwillie
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Allan Goodwillie » Sat Oct 12, 2019 9:48 am

Philip will be doing his excellent job with the photographs of the layouts and I know that he was intending putting up photos covering the scale and depth of the Burntisland layout so I thought I might put up one or two showing some of the added detail.

DSC05791.JPG
This area around the back of the power station has had a fair amount of detail added and is now operational with wagons being shunted to and from the yard. The little Neilson tank (one of the original engines from the first days of the layout is due for retirement as more locomotives are built, so this was its last outing on the layout.


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The entrance of the engine shed. The main shed building has been built by Lindsay Galloway and the water tank by Jim Pairman and the working crane by John Crompton


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There are loads of street detail around the entrance to the station which never seems to get photographed.


Allan :)

Philip Hall
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Philip Hall » Sat Oct 12, 2019 7:15 pm

Allan, thank you for the complimentary prediction of how good the pictures might be. No pressure there then.

They will be a while yet, as work gets in the way, and there are several hundred to work my way through. Then they will go off to webmasterJohn for him to form into the Retrospective. So holding your breath on this is not advised. I have had a quick canter through them and seen that I do have some detail shots, but from some distance away, so a different viewpoint to yours.

Philip

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Allan Goodwillie
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Re: Scaleforum 2019

Postby Allan Goodwillie » Sun Oct 13, 2019 7:01 pm

Hi Philip, :)

not at all I really do appreciate someone who has an ability to take a good photograph and has a genuine interest in the variations that different equipment brings. I know that it will take a bit of time for all the work to be done on preparing the photographs for publication. Your photographs of the layout taken the last time we were down at Scalefourum I still think are the best that I have seen taken.

Thought I might add a few more shots tonight - again close-ups. The rear of the layout is now some distance from our audience, yet the level of detail remains the same throughout.

DSC05749.JPG
Here we have the entrance to the station. The station building was built by Alan Ferguson and the train shed by Alasdair Taylor, the hotel by Don Rowland, the forecourt by Lindsay Galloway and the various horse vehicles by Lindsay and Ray Paul. Sadly Ray is no longer with us with his good common sense and humour.


DSC05806.JPG
A close-up of the coaling shed towards the rear of the layout, engines built by myself, Jim Summers, and Bob Hetherington. The new back scene by Bruce Murray. The Lammerlaws signal box by Bruce Neil and the bridge by my friend Richard Chown who again sadly is no longer with us, but remains a great inspiration.


DSC05724.JPG
The end view of the West Dock which is not always seen by the public depending where we are placed at an exhibition. The ship on the right was built by Bruce Murray and the one alongside the power station by Ray Nalton. The power station was built by myself and the baseboards by Richard Darby. This area was photographed prior to all the latest additions at this end around the power station.


Again just a tasting for those who were unable to come along to Scalefourum

Allan :)


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