Bradwell Q6

DougN
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Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:36 am

Hello all this is the first time that I have posted on the new forum... (Yes I know it has been around a long time and what is my excuse?)

I have lashed out and ordered the New Dave Bradwell Q6 kit and a full compliment of Alan Gibson wheels. Motor and Gear box is up in the air at the moment as I am uncertain as to what bits to get. My intention is to build the Q6 into a loco that got around and as far south as York and up to the boarders in the LNER period. Has anyone built one of these new kits (or is that started as I understtand they only came out at S4North). I would like to hear what your thoughts are. I have built the Bradwell J27 and B1 kits previously. But it has been a long time since I had a go at a kit due to Kids and renovating the house.... alright 8 years!

If things go to plan I will add photos and build items on here as an idea of probably what not to do!

Doug
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

simonmoore

Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby simonmoore » Sun Sep 19, 2010 6:49 am

Hi Doug although i have not seen the Bradwell kit for the Q6 i must admit i am looking forward to seeing just how it goes together & how well the build is. How much was the kit ?

Simon.

DougN
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Sun Sep 19, 2010 9:43 am

Dave is Air mailing it to me at the moment. It was 160quid+postage, the gibson wheels which do not include the crank pins came to 35quid air mailed (i didn't get a ex post figure, inc VAT figure). As it will take me in excess of 140 hours or more to build it it becomes a cheap form of entertainment!

Over all it is pricey number but I know that I will enjoy getting back into etched kit building!

I also have a thought for a new Layout in P4 which I am calling the "donut" as I think it will be a NER style along the lines of Spital fields but 9ft diameter and about 15" wide. I can have the tops CNC milled for me via a couple of cabinet makers I know... Though I will have to give them some more Joinery work as the day job! Which have an accuracy I understand of about 0.02mm. That is even longer term plan than the Q6. I have a thing for continuous runs and being able to leave the layout up allows trains to circulate while doing other things. I guess that is why I have enjoyed a period of RTR modelling in OO. Also I can try out new ideas and techniqueson that before the P4 version. Any way I have digressed into other thoughts.

I guess also as I have committed to the kit a RTR version in OO will be about 18 months away! :shock:

Doug
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

simonmoore

Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby simonmoore » Sun Sep 19, 2010 6:46 pm

I think RTR is a bit boring a kits a more personal item that you get many hours of fun making & a lifetime of fun playing with. I really look forward to seeing it come together i myself wouldnt mind the bradwell k1 & dubdee the later being something i need in multiples for my planned layout.

Simon.

DougN
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Thu Sep 30, 2010 2:43 am

Well the kit has finally turn up. David who I have great admiration for in his design technique has done a beautiful job on the kit. I have already noticed the design development from the J27, and the B1 which I enjoyed greatly.

I am looking forward to a few hours with a hot soldering iron, a few fine files to put it together. I will pass these on to any one who is interested.
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

DougN
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Sat Oct 02, 2010 9:07 am

I have finally had a chance to pull the kit out and take a photo.
Q6 kit 01.jpg

The wheels, are from Gibson and the motor was found unused in my modelling desk today :shock: I don't know when I got that one?

I think the motor may fit it is down to the formers in the boiler and throat on the fire box but looking at the drawing I think it will
Motor 01.jpg


All I need now is some serious spare time!
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

simonmoore

Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby simonmoore » Sat Oct 02, 2010 9:56 am

Doug am i right in thinking that quite alot of the kit is lamanates ??? i've just been taking a close up look of the frets. I'm curious because this is a kit i am interested in myself as i said .

Simon.

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Tim V
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby Tim V » Sat Oct 02, 2010 11:18 am

I think Dave Bradwell favours motor in the tender, you'll get better weight distribution.
Here is an ROD chassis I'm building at the moment, Canon 18:33 in the tender, 2:1 drop down and 38:1 in the loco. Maximum scale speed, about 28mph, just like the real one!
IMG_0090.JPG
IMG_0090.JPG (72.13 KiB) Viewed 10112 times
Tim V
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ScottW
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby ScottW » Sat Oct 02, 2010 2:21 pm

[quote="Tim V"]
Canon 18:33 in the tender, 2:1 drop down and 38:1 in the loco.

Very interesting Tim. Can you expand a little more on the tender drive and gearboxes, what make are the gearboxes?

Scott

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Tim V
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby Tim V » Sat Oct 02, 2010 6:07 pm

Both gearboxes are scratch built, but Exactoscale do a very similar 2:1 box, and the worm box can be any, a Highlevel can be built for remote. Shaft was from Branchlines.
Tim V
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DougN
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Sun Oct 03, 2010 9:35 am

Thanks Tim

I will have to go diving into my collection boxes. i think i might have an orginal Exacto 1:38 box in there (or 2)... havn't seen them for a while. i do agree agout the recommended set up from Dave Bradwell. But I am more concerned about my engineering to get all the boxes, UJ's etc in line and operational. That is why I am reluctant to head in that direction. But as I have said things are not fixed until I actually get to the Chassis/footplate and most of the tender built So allowing the building of the loco as suggested.

i have noticed some little things already. the clean up of the chassis spacers needs checking to get to the 15.3mm dimension. i have filed off the cusp and they are all sitting at 15.35mm making the chassis that much tighter!
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

DougN
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Thu Oct 07, 2010 9:44 pm

Well I have got into the chassis building a bit this week. As usual the kit instructions are up to Dave's usual high standard :) It makes building the kit that much easier. One thing I have to say is watch the dimensions, so one of the most important tools I am using at the moment is the Vernier!Below is the Chassis as it stands. I have attached the cylinder former (115) to show the outline. I have installed the footplate brakets with stiffening flange. These were a bit of fun but working carefully and installing the brake hanger wire through the holes has made it all work OK.
DSC03968crop.JPG


The next stage is to jump back to the footplate and fabricate the main sections of that. This way I can see if the portescap is going to fit OK or not. Also it crosses over onto the chassis in fixings and widths!

Soldering is a little bit of a mess at the moment. I am just about back in practise soldering. The one thing I have to remember is to only use the smallest amount each time, then clean the iron.

I will see how far I get this weekend! :P
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

simonmoore

Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby simonmoore » Thu Oct 07, 2010 10:01 pm

With regards to the dimentions Doug what have you had to watch out? The job looks good so far it looks like a tidy model so far.

Simon.

DougN
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Fri Oct 08, 2010 2:24 am

Thanks Simon, It is taking a fair bit of effort for me to keep it really clean! Dave gives you the dimensions you need to have. As I have found the dimensions after I think I have cleaned the cusp off seem to average between .05 and .1mm over what Dave recommends. So it is out with the files and file, check, file, check, file, check....!Once it is on the dimension that is when I put it together! I have made the chassis an average of .05mm under what dave has said as I find the little extra clearance allows for my modells to work a little bit better!
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

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Will L
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby Will L » Fri Oct 08, 2010 8:33 am

DougN wrote:... Dave gives you the dimensions you need to have. As I have found the dimensions after I think I have cleaned the cusp off seem to average between .05 and .1mm over what Dave recommends. ...


Does that matter? i.e. what tolerances does Mr Bradwell expect? I'm not surprised you've been a busy boy if your trying to work to better than +/- 0.05mm!

Will

DougN
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Fri Oct 08, 2010 12:35 pm

Well not really Will. I am trying to be as accurate all the way through to the dimensions recommended in the instructions. With the vernier out filing to a known dimension is realatively easy. the kit is extremely accurately etched. I have tonight put a number of bits on the chassis and put the foot plate together. dave has the buildability down to a fine art. I might say that this is my 3rd kit from Dave (the others being the J27 and the B1) So far I have only spent 3 night on the kit and it is really starting to look like the loco that it is supposed to be. I will also say that I want this to be the best running and looking loco I have built so far! So between the fabulous kit and my extra effort I think I will have something to be really proud of! I think I also need to buy a new camera so I can get some really good shots on the way through. the Sony 7.2Mp isn't really up to the job at close range. Time to look for a new one! Lets see how far I get with things over the week end before the next lot of photos! :twisted:
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

DougN
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:39 am

Well part way through the weekend and the loco now looks like:-
Q6 p1 101010.jpg

AS you can see this kit certainly looks like a Q6 even with out the boiler going on!

A trick I have noticed else where with the exacto scale bearings is the hold is off centre in the bearing. I have marked the bottom with black marker so I know which way round they need to be installed. For example going clockwise using a vernier (my favorite tool at the moment :) ) the bearing were N .56mm, E.48mm, S.46mm, W.47mm I am not really concerned by the N or S measurement as this can be lost in the top and bottom of the horn guide. I don't think it will matter to the running if a wheelis .08 of a mm up or down BUT the side to side measurement could really stuff things up to the tune of .10mm. So with all exacto bearings from now on that I know have come from one batch I will be measuring and trying to get the east and west measurements as close as possible So things matche the coupling rod centres.

I have been thinking about the Chassis tools (chassis2 etc) and whether these could be used for the construction of this kit. To which I am thinking may be not! :-?
Attachments
q6 p3 101010.jpg
Q6 p2 101010.jpg
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

simonmoore

Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby simonmoore » Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:23 pm

It's looking very good is that Doug it looks very well designed & etched :D It's an enjoyable thread looking forward to seeing the rest of it come together.

Simon.

DougN
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Thu Oct 14, 2010 2:12 am

Well, I have temporarily fitted up the Gibson wheels on the horn blocks. The Wheels are from the "New Gibson" I have noticed that the plastic centres seem to be harder than the previous and they seem to be more nicely moulded and the tyres seem to be better produced with less tool marks.I think they are the best wheels I have had from them!

Also I have built up the cylinders and the slide bar bracket. Dave has really out done him self with the design accuracy in that the dimensioned slide bars fit so precisely in the cylinders it all practically Jig builds together. On fitting the cylinder/slide bars racket together it fitted more or less exactly in the right location. :D . I will up load a photo or two in the next few days.

Putting the wheels under the chassis really shows how good this will be!
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

simonmoore

Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby simonmoore » Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:44 pm

It's all quite on the Bradwell front !!

Any further updates Doug i've been keeping my eye's peeled.

Simon.

DougN
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Wed Nov 03, 2010 2:28 am

Not much progress in the last week or so... seems inversly proportional to me building stuff at work! :( I have done a little in the way of installing the castings to the foot plate. The Brass castings are beutiful though slight miss registration takes but a moment of filing. I also have a little bit of a problem in identifying the casting and the orientation.

I have asked a friend with rollers to roll the boiler for me. I just need to get the bits to him to do his magic! Let alone chase up my lost Crank pins they are in the house.... some where! :?

The modelling desk has taken up residence at the end of the dinning table so my progress on this loco has been more than the last few years!
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

DougN
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Sun Nov 07, 2010 2:38 am

A few photos of the progress for that last few weeks
Q6 Part built1 071110.jpg
Q6 Part built1 071110.jpg


The clearances are certainly X rated.... I think that might be for the language that you would be using! :o
Attachments
Q6 Part built2 071110.jpg
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

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Will L
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby Will L » Sun Nov 07, 2010 7:23 pm

DougN wrote:The clearances are certainly X rated.... I think that might be for the language that you would be using! :o


I'll bet. For the sake of comparison, on the O4 I went with:-

1st axle, no side play and crank-pin nuts recessed into the rods. Clearance behind the slide bars/cross head minimal, even after I had cheated a little bit on the cylinders, piston rod/slide bars may not be exactly on the cylinder centre line, but the cylinders are where they should be.

2nd axle, a small amount of side play (roughly 0.5m), crank pin nuts recessed into the rods so they don't catch the piston rod, which (cheating again) are cranked out slightly.

3rd axle, no side play, "drive" is on this axle, both piston rod and gearbox, normal crank pin nuts

4th axle, all the side play possible on the 16mm width chassis and normal crank pin nuts

With 1st and 3rd axles having no side play only a little is required on the second axle as the wheel are small and quite close together. A lot more is needed on the 4th. The result goes round 3'6" curves. :D

Will

DougN
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Sun Nov 07, 2010 9:21 pm

Thanks Will,

I have been keeping pretty much to what DB recommends which is for a 36" radius. I did take a photo of the front slide bar/ crank pin locations but I got distracted when up loading. The front crank pin is designed to be recessed and I have set it up to allow the gibson nut to go into the rod. I have only temporarily mounted the con rods so the CP bearings and the nuts all need to be seated properly.

The 2nd axles Crank pins I beleive can go to standard BUT they have to be thined also. This is also a challange in that the Rivet fro the rods need to be thined down.

One thing I have been thinking about is the over lays for the rods. There is alot of them and i I have droped the Brasses from some of the rods to allow a little bit of clearance. Though that may be only 0.3mm

After putting the photos up I put all the rods on the CP's to see where it all fell. The little ends both lay on the centre of the slid bars! Also I have looked at where the Portescap will end up sitting which does seem to be in the right spot. I still have reservations regarding the firebox throat width to get the motor in! It will JUST slide through the frames (upper section above the foot plate) It depends on whether the fire box sides will allow it to slide through and where they are sitting. If they sit inside the frames I don't think the motor will fit BUT if they sit ontop which may be the fudge to get it to work! :?: Otherwise I think it will be a 14XX mashima and a Comet gearbox (which is again in the house somewhere.) Abit like the kids Guniea Pig which has escaped and appears every day or 2!
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

DougN
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Re: Bradwell Q6

Postby DougN » Wed Apr 20, 2011 11:49 am

Must appologise to all as it has been such a long time since I reported on the Q6...Well since I cleared the table for Summer! Any how starting again this week I have "unlocked" the axles, trimmed the crank pins and fixed the front 2!Then I moved onto the boiler rolling:The current stat of play with the boiler just proped on top of the existing structure.

Q6 loco 01a.jpg

The Boiler has some nice designed in detail. The rivets have been done using a blunted pin and a small hammer (yes it is the one I use for track laying!)

Q6 loco 01a.jpg

This photo is of the boiler and the smoke box assembly. It is so tight to get to slid into the boiler barrel! One problem I always seem to have is the rings for holding the boiler to shape always distort on me this one is no different. The solution that I use is to laminate the ring to another sheet of 12 thou brass to boost the thickness up. Then I can get it in and not have any distortion. I also need to do this to the firebox front. Though in this case I havn't and I got it the wrong way round (back facing forwards) the etched line goes to the back for all the others! :( .

I am hoping to keep going at this pace for a while though I do now have to look at another motor/ gearbox arrangement as the Escap won't fit due to the fire box front. So back to the drawing board!
Attachments
Q6 boiler 3.jpg
Q6 boiler 2a.jpg
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling


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