Here We Go (2)... Passenger Stock

Armchair Modeller
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Here We Go (2)... Passenger Stock

Postby Armchair Modeller » Fri Oct 02, 2015 10:37 pm

Just a taster of something to come........

Falcon-Trailer-sm.gif
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The drawing is for a narrow gauge trailer, but they could be supplied in a variety of gauges. These trailers were built by Falcon, which eventually became Brush. Similar cars were made by several manufacturers and appeared in various places, including Guernsey and Ireland. Concerns like the Dublin & Blessington and the Swansea & Mumbles used similar trailers in an interurban role, hauled by steam locos well into the 20th century.

It was quite a headache working out how to build these. I looked at several tram kits, but nothing gelled. Eventually I saw a Kielkraft London General bus kit on eBay - perfect!

I exaggerate slightly, as some modifications will be required, but the overall size and shape of the passenger area is great. I can also use the stairs. The lower saloon windows would be difficult to scratchbuild, but the London General body is as near spot-on for size as I could wish for. I can make one trailer out of two Kielkraft kits. I managed to pick up six at quite reasonable prices, so that's 3 trailers to build.
Last edited by Armchair Modeller on Tue Feb 09, 2016 1:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Terry Bendall
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Re: Here We Go (2)... Passenger Trailers

Postby Terry Bendall » Sat Oct 03, 2015 7:21 am

A street tramway that used similar trailer vehicles was the Wolverton and Stony Stratford Tramway built to a gauge of 3ft 6ins and which was fairly unique in that steam locomotives were used throughout its fairly short life The tramway opened in 1887 with a further 2½ mile long extension opened in 1888 to Deanshanger, to the west of Stony Stratford, but the tramway company quickly ran into financial trouble and declared bankruptcy in 1889. The line was purchased by a syndicate of Bedford businessmen, which reopened the Wolverton to Stony Stratford section in 1891. The Deanshanger extension never re-opened. In the early 1920s the line was taken over by the LNWR, which purchased a new Bagnall tram locomotive. After the LNWR merged into the London Midland and Scottish Railway the line was closed, in 1926. One of the trailer cars is preserved in the Milton Keynes museum.

A builder of self propelled tramcars was the Motor Rail and Tramcar Company of Bedford who also built the well know Simplex range of petrol and later diesel engine locomotives initially for service on the War Department Light Railways of the Western Front during World War One and later for industrial use. Many of the tramcars made by the firm were exported to India.

Terry Bendall

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Re: Here We Go (2)... Passenger Trailers

Postby Armchair Modeller » Sat Oct 03, 2015 10:53 am

Hi Terry

There are drawings and photos of the W&SS trailers online here http://www.mkheritage.co.uk/os/doc/tran/tra.html. One of them was huge.

I have the Plateway Press Motor Rail book, which is very interesting - and may offer inspiration for a model or two in due course.

In general I am looking for stock that creates a different atmosphere to the normal P4 layout. Ideas are more than welcome. Problem is, there are so many possibilities................ :shock:

Armchair Modeller
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Re: Here We Go (2)... Passenger Trailers

Postby Armchair Modeller » Mon Nov 09, 2015 7:32 pm

The first problem to be tackled with the passenger trailers is the bogies - or more specifically, the wheels. Here are drawings of the kind of bogie I am thinking of using.

a-Falcon-A01.gif
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This particular drawing is for narrow gauge. The gauge and wheelbase varied, as did the suspension details. Some, for example, had enormous leaf springs spanning the axle boxes. The wheels are 21" in diameter. The ones fitted in the drawing have very narrow, tramway-style tyres. For a bogie running on conventional railway tracks, wider tyres are probably desirable. Whatever, they must have been very rough-riding - and not really suitable for high speed running.

As far as I can find out, there are currently no suitable RTR wheel sets of 7mm diameter available. After a great deal of procrastination, I decided to experiment with adapting N gauge wheels to 18.83mm gauge. 2mm fine scale wheels are too fine. The tyres are too narrow and the flanges too small. They would probably be worth considering for a model running on proper tram tracks though.

I looked at several different N gauge wheels and settled on Farish coach wheels for my little experiment. The profile is not too dissimilar to P4 standards. The flanges are very slightly bigger and the coning of the tyres is slightly greater, but otherwise, they look pretty reasonable. Also, the wheels are insulated from the axles, which makes life easier when thinking about axles. I experimented with some brass tube I happened to have in stock. I think I bought it in a metre-long length from B&Q. The outside diameter is 2mm, with an internal diameter of around 1.4mm. My approach was to cut the Farish axes in two down the middle and drill out the brass tube to the right diameter for the half axles to slide into. That way, I could widen the gauge from 9mm to 18.83mm. The Farish axles are 1.5mm diameter, but I had to use a 1.6mm drill to get a comfortable fit. I widened the internal diameter of the tube in stages, using 0.1mm increments.

I have only done one axle so far, but the result far exceeds my expectations - beginner's luck maybe? The wheels run successfully through my pointwork - and with no noticeable wobble. I suspect a batch will produce a few that are unacceptable, some that are OK and a few that are perfect. Only time will tell. I also did an experiment with some 6.2mm wheels - this time from a batch bought from N-Train. The axles on these are slightly smaller in diameter, so less drilling was requires. There is a pronounced curve between the flange and the tyre though, which might cause a few problems in regular use. The next step will be to build a couple of rough and ready bogies to test the wheel sets more thoroughly - one bogie for each type of wheel.

Here are some photos.......

Firstly, the 7mm Farish wheels with P4 wagon wheels behind

a-DSCF4357.gif
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Then, a similar photo of the 6.2mm N-Train wheels with P4 wagon wheels behind

a-DSCF4353.gif
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... and finally, the three together in a side view

a-DSCF4358.gif
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I will probably require small-sized wheels for several projects. Apart from the passenger trailers, there may be small railcars and other oddities to come. Hopefully, this little experiment gives me hope that I can use realistic wheel diameters for these prototypes.

Armchair Modeller
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Re: Here We Go (2)... Passenger Trailers

Postby Armchair Modeller » Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:43 pm

As an addendum to the above post, I have since found some aluminium tube in my scrap box with an internal diameter of around 1.6mm. The Farish/Bachmann axles are a very slightly loose fit, but when glued in place seem to run true. That will save a lot of wear and tear on my fingers - and a bit of time too.

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Will L
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Re: Here We Go (2)... Passenger Trailers

Postby Will L » Tue Nov 10, 2015 3:48 pm

Armchair Modeller wrote: The Farish/Bachmann axles are a very slightly loose fit, but when glued in place seem to run true. That will save a lot of wear and tear on my fingers - and a bit of time too.


Hint, Loctite retainers (603/638) are intended to help to centralise the shaft in joints like this.

Armchair Modeller
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Re: Here We Go (2)... Passenger Trailers

Postby Armchair Modeller » Tue Nov 10, 2015 6:16 pm

Many thanks Will - that is very useful to know :thumb

I hope to do a batch build soon, as I need 12 axles of the 7mm wheels for the trailers. Loctite has been added to my shopping list.

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Craig Warton
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Re: Here We Go (2)... Passenger Trailers

Postby Craig Warton » Wed Nov 11, 2015 10:21 am

Things like this have a very bad effect on me!

Prior to electrification, the Sydney tramways used Steam tram motors with trailers - including double deck trailers.

http://nla.gov.au/nla.pic-vn4778427


How could you not like that?

Regards,

Craig W
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grovenor-2685
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Re: Here We Go (2)... Passenger Trailers

Postby grovenor-2685 » Wed Nov 11, 2015 11:13 am

Craig,
Some fascinating pics in that album, any ideas on what this was for?
Image
Regards

Armchair Modeller
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Re: Here We Go (2)... Passenger Trailers

Postby Armchair Modeller » Wed Nov 11, 2015 11:50 am

Craig,

That is a great photo - as is the album. I must warn you though that modelling this kind of thing could easily become addictive ;)

I like this one, but a working model would be challenging!

Image

I do have some drawings and photos for the Baldwin tram loco. It would be a perfect loco for my tramway. Too many other projects in the way at the moment though!

Winander
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Re: Here We Go (2)... Passenger Trailers

Postby Winander » Wed Nov 11, 2015 12:25 pm

grovenor-2685 wrote:Craig,
Some fascinating pics in that album, any ideas on what this was for?
http://www.nla.gov.au/nla.pic-vn4778633
Regards


Keith,

The page says it is "Two men with the grip mechanism of a cable tram, Melbourne, ca. 1890" ;) Not the sort of thing you'd want to get any limbs tangled with!

regards
Richard

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grovenor-2685
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Re: Here We Go (2)... Passenger Trailers

Postby grovenor-2685 » Wed Nov 11, 2015 12:54 pm

Ah, thanks, I missed that hover caption.
Regards


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