LMS/Midland Crimson Lake

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jsherratt
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LMS/Midland Crimson Lake

Postby jsherratt » Fri Feb 28, 2014 12:31 pm

Does anyone have any suggestions on which shade of car aerosol paint would be a good match for Midland/LMS Crimon Lake?

I think in the past, it was suggested that Leyland Damask Red was quite a good match. I used this to paint my K's 00 Princess longer ago than I care to remember, and I think it came out as a colour that looked alright to me.

A quick look on ebay suggests this colour is still available. Does anyone have any other thoughts on this?

John

dal-t
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Re: LMS/Midland Crimson Lake

Postby dal-t » Fri Feb 28, 2014 12:51 pm

There is a list of car paints suitable for railway colours that has been around for a while - a good version of it can be found here, along with other useful data. It does indeed recommend Damask Red, as used by Ford as well as the late unlamented BL. I've used it for LMS coaches in the past, but found it a trifle bright (though this is probably not the place to get into the whole scale colour debate). I'll just say that I now prefer Cherry Scale Paints MR Engine Red - and a 50ml tin seems to be lasting for ever. Oh, and stand by for incoming on whether the Midland and the LMS really used the same colour. FWIW (not a lot on this forum, I'm afraid) my view is they did, or if they didn't no-one would notice a difference in our scale - but I'm sure someone will be along to shoot that down very shortly.
David L-T

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jsherratt
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Re: LMS/Midland Crimson Lake

Postby jsherratt » Fri Feb 28, 2014 2:36 pm

That's an interesting list, thanks, I don't recall seeing it before. Things being equal - I would normally use tin from the enamel ranges of either Precision or Cherry. But I plan on having a "bash" at some coach lining for the first time and am looking for a non-enamel base colour that will be a bit more resistant to no doubt many corrections of errors and slips.

At the risk of generating more incoming - I would tend to agree with you. My judgment of perusing the various available sources would be that the LMS and MR shades were pretty much the same; sufficiently close for us not to worry too much in 4 mm scale. By the time you allow for effects of varnishing and then cleaning/polishing followed by the inevitable fading and then different lighting at various times of the day/year and so on ...... I think we can get away with using the same colour for MR and LMS.

Digressing - I see the list refers to a NSR Madder Lake and NSR Maroon. I am not sure there was a colour the NSR referred to as Maroon. Perhaps they are intended to refer to the same colour.

John

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Andy W
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Re: LMS/Midland Crimson Lake

Postby Andy W » Fri Feb 28, 2014 2:47 pm

I've used Damask red aerosols on my MR locos and carriages in the past ideal for lining over with enamels. However, I bought some enamel Precision MR crimson and used it to repair some damaged panels. The colours appear identical. So it's a matter of whether you prefer cellulose or enamel base coats.
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Paul Willis
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Re: LMS/Midland Crimson Lake

Postby Paul Willis » Fri Feb 28, 2014 7:34 pm

jsherratt wrote:That's an interesting list, thanks, I don't recall seeing it before. Things being equal - I would normally use tin from the enamel ranges of either Precision or Cherry. But I plan on having a "bash" at some coach lining for the first time and am looking for a non-enamel base colour that will be a bit more resistant to no doubt many corrections of errors and slips.

Having no views one way or the other about Midland red (or Midland Red, as I still have my paternal grandfather's bus ticket dispensing roll machine thing) but having recently embarked on the enjoyable pleasure of lining, I heartily recommend your approach. Using cellulose as the base coat so that you can use a thinners-loaded brush for corrections to the lining is an excellent way to go.

Cheers
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billbedford
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Re: LMS/Midland Crimson Lake

Postby billbedford » Sat Mar 01, 2014 9:54 am

Flymo748 wrote:Having no views one way or the other about Midland red (or Midland Red, as I still have my paternal grandfather's bus ticket dispensing roll machine thing) but having recently embarked on the enjoyable pleasure of lining, I heartily recommend your approach. Using cellulose as the base coat so that you can use a thinners-loaded brush for corrections to the lining is an excellent way to go.


Except, of course, that modern car paints are acrylic rather than cellulose.
Bill Bedford
Mousa Models
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Andy W
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Re: LMS/Midland Crimson Lake

Postby Andy W » Sat Mar 01, 2014 5:49 pm

Very true Bill, but they form a great base on which to line in enamels (or water based ink/paint).
Make Worcestershire great again.
Build a wall along the Herefordshire border and make them pay for it.

Natalie Graham

Re: LMS/Midland Crimson Lake

Postby Natalie Graham » Sun Mar 02, 2014 12:07 am

I can never get into the idea of using car paints or others for modelling. It comes from when I was young and my dad was a painter and used to take great exception to the price of model paints given the size of the tin. The facts that the tins were big enough to complete the job, and many more, were cheaper to buy than a large tin of paint even if the price per litre, or whatever, was higher and that they were in the right colours never entered the equation. In consequence, if he realised I was going to be painting anything I would end up with a half gallon or bigger tin of some paint that was not quite the right shade. Perfect for painting N gauge models on the dining table - not. :? I do recall that Tekaloid coach enamel in dark crimson was what he came up with for a Midland loco. I had it for years before it dried up and it was actually not far off the right shade. One of his better efforts and a lot better than the time he produced a bygone relic from the early days of painting decorating he had found in the back of the paint store. This was a large block of something that was the size (and weight) of a bag of cement and wrapped in layers of polythene and sacking and which evidently was supposed to have lumps cut off and mixed with turpentine.I don't know how that would have worked out but dad seemed quite baffled that I preferred to buy a tinlet of Humbrol from the local model shop instead.

DougN
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Re: LMS/Midland Crimson Lake

Postby DougN » Sun Mar 02, 2014 2:30 am

The story is actually quite interesting Natalie, I say that as the day job does throw curly ones at me every so often. The main component of paint now is titanium dioxide. But hearing old methods interests me no end. If you find what the material was do fill me in. 15 years ago when I was working as a building estimator I spent a lot of my time working on restoration of some of the largest public buildings in Melbourne such as Parliament House and a couple of the cathedrals along with the state library. All interesting stuff but there was a need for experience with old construction techniques and materials. I do miss it a bit ...

Doug
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling


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