JJNewitt's Wonderful World of Wagons - General Merchandise Vans

[iak]

Very nice as usual Justin.

Would be interesting to know what Iain (IAK) van fleet numbers are.

In what context Matey? Sorry I don't quite follow.

Mind, those two vans are rather splendid Justin. Those undergubbins look very tasty.
Having built the odd dozen or three for Mostyn, your earlier time period will demand a lot of late grouping vans for sure.
The auld Ratio LMS has its uses, as does to the auld Ratio GWR ones. The Parkside LNER vans also have a place.
There is an article in the next Railway Modeller I believe by Ian Nuttall, related to LMS vans. Might be worth a gander.
All power to more vannage...

[Noel]

The results threw up a few interesting things. I hadn't realised that BR built so many compared with the big four (no idea why!)

The trend towards using vans instead of sheeted opens where possible had been an ongoing program from well before WW2, so that's part of the reason, I think. Another part was probably the 9ft wb VB vans you excluded because they had largely disappeared by 1964; they could not run in the growing number of fully or partially fitted trains running at higher speeds, and were probably beyond their economic life without an expensive overhaul, so had to be replaced. This may also account for the modernisation plan retro-fitting of VB not being applied to LMSR diagrams earlier than D1891 according to David Larkin, while unconverted unfitted vans would also have had to be replaced as BR aimed for all merchandise traffic to run in fitted wagons. Another minor factor was possibly the use of wooden underframes by the LNER up to the 1930s; these were much less robust than steel, and therefore more costly to maintain, so tended to be early casualties, including D94 despite its 10ft wb.

[davebradwell]

Didn't containers peak about this time, without delving into "Rowlands" to confirm? This would give even more covered vehicles.

DaveB

[iak]

I don't know if it is any use Justin but attached is the list of Van Stock on Mostyn.
Yes it is a later period but may provide some enlightenment.
A good source of guidance is Mr Bartletts photosite. Some very useful images are buried away for LMS/LNER vans.
See you in Crewe?

Mostyn Vans as of April 2023.xlsx

[Tony Wilkins]

The results threw up a few interesting things. I hadn't realised that BR built so many compared with the big four (no idea why!)

The trend towards using vans instead of sheeted opens where possible had been an ongoing program from well before WW2, so that's part of the reason, I think. Another part was probably the 9ft wb VB vans you excluded because they had largely disappeared by 1964; they could not run in the growing number of fully or partially fitted trains running at higher speeds, and were probably beyond their economic life without an expensive overhaul, so had to be replaced. This may also account for the modernisation plan retro-fitting of VB not being applied to LMSR diagrams earlier than D1891 according to David Larkin, while unconverted unfitted vans would also have had to be replaced as BR aimed for all merchandise traffic to run in fitted wagons. Another minor factor was possibly the use of wooden underframes by the LNER up to the 1930s; these were much less robust than steel, and therefore more costly to maintain, so tended to be early casualties, including D94 despite its 10ft wb.

I would agree with Noel's assessment and add that the last of the pre-grouping vans and opens were also being phased out so needed replacing.
Regards
Tony.

[jjnewitt]

I don't know why I was suprised by the numbers of BR vans built. I'd got it into my head that they'd be less common than they were but that's only because I hadn't actually looked at figures! Given the numbers of 'big four' designs built over a period what, 18 years and that BR was building BR 'standard' vans and vanwides for 11 years maybe I should be surprised there weren't more.

I don't know if it is any use Justin but attached is the list of Van Stock on Mostyn.
Yes it is a later period but may provide some enlightenment.

Interesting Iain, I'l have a look.

A good source of guidance is Mr Bartletts photosite. Some very useful images are buried away for LMS/LNER vans

True, it's a great resource, but you always have to bear in mind it's record of wagons in the 70s not the 50s or 60s when details could be very different. Also, the unusual seems to punch above it's weight and the number of pre-Nationalisation wagons is relatively low due to the culls so it's not necessarily a good indicator of quantities. There seems to be a lot of images of Gunpowder vans for example, and they were not common at all, despite what my workbench thinksl!!

See you in Crewe?

Looking at the lineup earlier we seem to be down on traders at the show which is a real shame but yes, all being well, I'll be there.

Justin