Brimsdown-The last grand project.

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Tony Wilkins
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Tony Wilkins » Wed Jun 09, 2021 11:24 am

And then of course one just has to put out some of the remaining track to see how it looks.
DSCF1277.jpg
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Terry Bendall
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Terry Bendall » Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:07 am

Tony Wilkins wrote:And then of course one just has to put out some of the remaining track to see how it looks.


Quite simple really! :D

Terry Bendall

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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Tony Wilkins » Thu Jun 10, 2021 10:57 am

Terry Bendall wrote:
Tony Wilkins wrote:And then of course one just has to put out some of the remaining track to see how it looks.


Quite simple really! :D

Terry Bendall


Well maybe, compared to the amount of work needed, trimming and tweaking to actually get the track to fit between the baseboards joints, especially at this end where the curved track is.

Regards
Tony.
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Tony Wilkins » Mon Jun 14, 2021 1:06 pm

Tony Wilkins wrote:
Terry Bendall wrote:
Tony Wilkins wrote:And then of course one just has to put out some of the remaining track to see how it looks.


Quite simple really! :D

Terry Bendall


Well maybe, compared to the amount of work needed, trimming and tweaking to actually get the track to fit between the baseboards joints, especially at this end where the curved track is.

Regards
Tony.

Well having done so, it merely remained to glue it all down and over the last 3 or 4 days I have been doing precisely that.
DSCF1278.jpg

DSCF1279.jpg

So today another major milestone was reached with the final section of the main line glued in place.
This picture is hot off the camera.
DSCF1280.jpg

There just remains the goods yard to do.
The white pieces of plastic are just temporary place keepers for the catch pit covers I need to make, but don't currently have the correct grilles needed for them and are stuck in place with double sided tape.
I now have 5 baseboards in the wiring queue, which at roughly one a week if I'm luck, it will still be a while before I can attempt to run anything all the way round the circuit and I also have one rather bad baseboard joint to attend to at one end of the storage yard.
Regards
Tony.
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Dave Holt
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Dave Holt » Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:10 pm

Tony.
The ballasted track really does look very impressive.
Dave.

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John Donnelly
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby John Donnelly » Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:31 pm

Impressive stuff Tony.

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steve howe
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby steve howe » Fri Jun 18, 2021 5:32 pm

Amazing work Tony, can I ask what the minimum curve radii are?

Steve

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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Tony Wilkins » Sat Jun 19, 2021 12:26 pm

Hi Steve.
The inner most curve at that end is 1400mm or 55" radius. The Up and Down are 61" and 63" respectively. I wanted the main lines to be 5 foot plus. There are some curves tighter than this in the Cable Company Sidings at about 52".
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Tony.
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Tony Wilkins » Tue Jul 27, 2021 9:06 pm

The wiring continues..........
I see little point in going into great detail about this, but progress there has been. I left the greatest challenges till the end. These being the two baseboards with lifting sections, one of which was shown in the last picture posted. The wiring for these is in effect a T junction, as it has to go both into the lifting section and onto the adjacent baseboards and has given me a few headaches at times. This is board O and shows some of the issues involved. To make matters worse, there will be a point motor on the lifting part, so wires run both to it and back from it.
DSCF1286.jpg

The connector for the next baseboard is underneath where the near hinge is.
DSCF1282.jpg

The lack of space required a multi level solution with things removable for access should it be needed.
However the complication of that baseboard pales into insignificance compared to this one.
DSCF1283.jpg

It may not look so bad at first glance, but baseboard Q is at the heart of layout as all the control systems come together and will have no less than six connectors for various functions. The triangular pieces of plywood are for mounting control circuit boards on.

Take the left hand side.
DSCF1285.jpg

The connector cable top left goes to the next baseboard R.
The connector at the bottom is where the signal box plugs in.

The right hand side.
DSCF1284.jpg

The large socket at the top connects to that under O shown above.
The next smaller socket is where the power supply feeds into the layout.
The cable hanging down connects to the main lifting flap, board P, which needs to be removable.
There is though one connector yet to be installed and this will go along the bottom rail, where the word panel can be seen, and will connect to the display panel. As it is currently uncertain just how many connections will be required, for the moment it is pending.
Sockets need cables and so.
DSCF1287.jpg

The outer cable will connect boards O to Q across the doorway and the inner cable is for the power supply.
At present none of the control wiring does anything, but it will.
Regards
Tony.
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Tony Wilkins » Wed Aug 11, 2021 12:40 pm

After months of wiring the time came to assemble all the baseboards and start testing, debugging and adjusting.
The first trial Down run of my test loco showed up several faults, which were remedied in succession. These consisted mainly of cleaning the rails and sorting out dry solder joints and in one case missed wiring. One rail length was dead and I found both droppers had not soldered. The next job was adjusting the poor alignment of rail joints. Finally the test loco made a trip Down the full length of what will be the scenic half of the layout.
Taking video footage was a whole new experiment and the first two were taken on my digital camera and my experiences as a novice setting up a Youtube account nearly defeated me, but somehow I have got there.

Then over the crossover and back on the Up.

Encouraged by this success, I than assembled a proper test train. After all, the main reason for building a large layout was to be able to run proper length trains. Several hours of tweaking and adjusting resulted in the train circuiting reliably. I then borrowed my wife's smart phone to take the following video, filmed on 2nd August.

Nearly five years of work have gone into getting this far and there is much, much more to do, but for the moment I intend to leave the layout as it is and concentrate on sorting out some of the rolling stock for the next 3 months or so and enjoy some running. It has been a long time coming.
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Tony.
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John Donnelly
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby John Donnelly » Wed Aug 11, 2021 1:42 pm

Looking good Tony. Having just got to a similar stage myself with the main line on my layout, it feels good to be able to get something running.

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Martin Wynne
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Martin Wynne » Wed Aug 11, 2021 2:17 pm

+1
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Winander
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Winander » Wed Aug 11, 2021 5:35 pm

I have been eagerly anticipating this for years. I thought something was amiss on the first video. It was merely the fact the loco was so far away to be easily missed.

Congratulations and enjoy the running.
Last edited by Winander on Wed Aug 11, 2021 9:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby triumph3 » Wed Aug 11, 2021 6:46 pm

That’s a 62 wagon train, excellent!

Well done Tony, a major milestone achieved.

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Julian Roberts
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Julian Roberts » Fri Aug 13, 2021 7:49 pm

Fantastic milestone passed Tony. I imagine that to get the first trains running must feel a great achievement after 5 years!

I don't suppose such a competition is in your mind, but maybe you will be able to demonstrate Mr Franks' Wharfeside trick is possible in P4 too, some day in the future? https://youtu.be/l7vNZioYlss

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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Tony Wilkins » Sat Aug 14, 2021 12:47 pm

Er, no.
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby JFS » Sun Aug 15, 2021 2:23 pm

Excellent work as always Tony!

Julian Roberts wrote: ... maybe you will be able to demonstrate Mr Franks' Wharfeside trick ...


Looks impressive ...

A well-known magician once produced a video showing him tossing a coin 10 times and every single toss came up heads. There was no fakery involved - so how did he do it?

The explanation was simple - he actually shot almost 9000 such videos before he got ten heads: a statistically typical result.

Not that I am accusing anyone you understand ... :D

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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Tony Wilkins » Sun Aug 15, 2021 2:59 pm

You could always run the video backwards!
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Tony Wilkins » Thu Sep 09, 2021 3:57 pm

I have been slowly assembling trains and in some cases resuming my wagon building programme that long ago went into hibernation. This Tank wagon train is a case in point. I converted 12 of these wagons many years back and on going through the remaining boxes discovered that I had already started on the next batch of 5. These were progressed to the same state as those already converted over several days and added to the train. There are a further 6 to do.


A Parcels train consisting of a assortment of vehicles. The EE3 is an experiment, a Bachmann body loosely fitted to a Vitrains chassis.


The third video is a train of Bogie Bolsters. This was supposed to be a quickie. Instant train, just add wheels. It didn't quite work out like that of course. I had over a period of time purchased about 20 Bogie Bolster Cs, mainly second hand. Some Mainline but most were Bachmann. To begin with I just changed the wheels and assembled the train with the Mainline ones at the head followed by the Bachmann ones and some old Mainline ones I converted long ago. I found that the Mainline ones derailed but the Bachmann ones, by and large didn't despite their appearing to be more or less the same apart from the couplings. The only difference I could find was the Mainline bogies allowed little or no end float. So I gently melted waisted brass bearings into them with a soldering iron until the surface of the bearing was flush with the inside face of the bogie side frame. One does need to be careful to make sure all 4 bearings are in the same plane as they can drift while the plastic is soft. I also replaced the clunky tension lock couplings with 3 links. This improved things, but I considered them too light. The underframe of these wagons has a space for weight, simply remove the two screws to access. I replaced the thin steel weights with some 1.5mm sheet lead having about 3 times the weight. It was when I came to do the Bachmann wagons that I discovered they included no weights at all, and yet they ran well. They all weight the same now.
I am currently building a batch of 8 Bogie Bolster Ds (Cambrian) to add some variety. There is one towards the rear of the train.

With apologies for the clutter on the windowsill, but its early days with this video lark and Google isn't helping either.
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Tony.
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Winander
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Winander » Thu Sep 09, 2021 6:23 pm

Tony Wilkins wrote:With apologies for the clutter on the windowsill


Who cares? The more the merrier I say and very inspiring and encouraging (and I need both, so thanks). You must be really pleased to get things running after all the effort and some trials and tribulations.
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Tony Wilkins » Fri Sep 10, 2021 12:41 pm

Thanks Richard.
It's been quite inspiring for me to actually get something running too. I am glad you are enjoying the progress and hope others are encouraged in their efforts. There is still a great deal to do to achieve my aim, but I am slowly getting there.
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Tony.
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Paul Townsend
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Paul Townsend » Mon Sep 13, 2021 4:19 pm

Tony Wilkins wrote:Back to the subject in hand.
The connectors will need to be mounted somewhere. With previous layouts, I have always mounted the connectors underneath, however these present more of a challenge with age, so a different approach was called for, especially as the underside of many of these baseboards will be pretty inaccessible due to the sub-frame the straight boards rest upon. I therefore decided that the inter-board connections would be through the side face of the baseboards.
DSCF0939.jpg
This though is to get slightly out of sequence. The first thing I needed to do was make some mounting plates for the connector.
DSCF0953.jpg
The first ones were fashioned from some scrap Aluminium plate I had available.
Cutting the rectangular hole to just clear the base of the connector is the fun part. I resorted to using some Abra files (who remembers those?) and files to clean up the hole for a close fit. Years ago you used to be able to get rectangular Qmax cutters to do the job, but although round Qmax cutters are still available, square and rectangular ones don't seem to be. Mind you we did manage to break a couple of the bigger rectangular ones, so perhaps that's why.
The bare plate (minus connector) was used to mark a rectangle and the fixing centers on the face of the baseboard. An outer rectangle was then marked sufficient to give clearance for the plug to go through and align with the socket.
The corners of the rectangle were drilled through and the hole cut out with a coping saw.
Next the fixing holes were drilled for M3 screws and countersunk. I had some long M3 screws and these were fitted with some threaded pillars to act as standoffs for the plates. These can be seen in this picture.
DSCF0957.jpg
The reason for these is to reduce the amount that the plug protrudes from the baseboard face.
The plugs look like this.
DSCF0972.jpg
DSCF0973.jpg
These have plastic covers, but metal ones are available too.
This is the one on the opposite end of the same board. The loom drops under the edge of the baseboard and is securely clamped to the inside face by a pair of large P clips.
DSCF0971.jpg
If anybody is tempted to try these connectors remember that quality costs. However if total reliability is your quest then you won't do any better.

Regards
Tony.

It happens that I have now got a few more 38way pairs for cheap sale.
See Member sales section.

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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Tony Wilkins » Mon Sep 27, 2021 9:59 pm

I wrote "I am currently building a batch of 8 Bogie Bolster Ds (Cambrian) to add some variety. There is one towards the rear of the train."

Here are some pictures of the batch including the one appearing in the video. It is the one with bogies fitted.
DSCF1289.jpg

The numbers refer to the Cambrian Kit range.
The two vehicles on the right are from the first Lot to Diag 1/472 and were fitted with LNER diamond framed bogies. Unfortunately 3 of the 4 bogies were faulty moldings and the central beam was off center enough for the wheels to touch and not rotate properly. This is the reason for the modification shown using the sideframes with a flexi beam I developed many years ago for use with Ratio bogies. The Ratio bogie pivots fixed to the underside of the floor needed 1mm removed from the top surface in order to obtain the correct buffer height.

The assembled bogies for the remaining wagons.
DSCF1288.jpg

The next job was to fit some weights to the underside, so cut some 9mm wide strips of lead sheet. These proved slightly too wide and were gently filed to fit with a coarse file until a sliding fit was obtained. They were then retained with some glue. The cross bracing could then be fitted to the trussing followed by the bogies. It was at this point that I discovered the buffers would be 1mm too high even assembling the kit as designed, so had to gently remove the bogie pivots before the glue set fully and remove the excess amount from the four pins around the head of the fixing screw (visible in the picture above) before refitting. This also entailed deepening the recess where the countersunk screw sits with a countersinking tool. The couplings were then fitted, 3 links in this case.
DSCF1293.jpg

The brake levers were then fitted (4 per wagon of 2 differing patterns).
Attention was then turned to the top of the wagons and the bolsters fixed in place. The stanchions will be omitted until after painting as they would be vulnerable to damage.
DSCF1303.jpg


Having now got the wagon building bug, I have been digging out some wagon projects that have been in deep hibernation and trying to revive them. I also have a quantity of wagons needing repair and a batch of fitted 16T mineral wagons that need unfitting, so plenty to keep me busy.

Regards
Tony.
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Tony Wilkins » Sun Oct 03, 2021 9:34 pm

Two of the dehibernated projects are a bit on the exotic side and I'm sure they will stir memories for some.
I need some Chlorine tankers for Brimsdown as there was a factory on the industrial complex that used it. Most of the time the traffic was catered for by 14 ton tank wagons (that nobody does a model of), but just occasionally there would be a larger bogie tank wagon in the delivery siding. Many years ago Triang produced a version which purported to be of the Murgatroyd's bogie tanker. I have had two in store for years with a view to converting them to P4. However a series of articles on Chlorine tank wagons by Peter Fidczuk in Railway Archive in 2007 showed just how wrong they are. The list is considerable. They are actually, for their time, not a bad representation of some 40 ton caustic liquor tankers owned by ICI, which from memory Triang also marketed a version of. Obviously in an attempt to broaden their market the Chlorine tank wagon was produced using the same tooling. At the time little prototype information was available so we accepted what the trade offered.
DSCF1304.jpg

That on the left has had its bogies replaced by the correct roller bearing plate pattern (Cambrian), oleo sprung buffers and instanter couplings, which improves the appearance compared with the original and also shows up the height difference with the unaltered wagon, P4 wheels being substituted for this picture. Further work will be undertaken to improve them. I was amused by the very idea of what I presume are pressure vents on top of such a wagon. I don't think so! Chlorine is nasty stuff.
The other project is rather different being a Triang / Hornby Ferry van. These were the first of a new generation of long wheelbase wagons on British Railways being built mid 1963 - 65. Although only 400 were built, they appear regularly in photographs of the era.
DSCF1306.jpg

The model has the two axles moulded as separate sub-frames that pivot to cope with toy curves. I installed MJT W irons and filed down the back of the axle boxes and springs to reuse them. The result thus far is I think an improvement. More detailing work to do.

And then there were two.
DSCF1307.jpg

DSCF1308.jpg

Regards
Tony.
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Re: Brimsdown-The last grand project.

Postby Tony Wilkins » Sun Dec 05, 2021 10:51 pm

Still on the wagon building theme, two further Chlorine tank wagons.
DSCF1309.jpg

These are from the Hornby OO stable and based on the 20ton variety that ICI owned. I replaced the very crude diecast underframe with a better modern plastic one modified to fit. They will both need to be renumbered.
The next batch of wagons have been in store half built for more years than I care to admit and were an attempt to represent some LMS wooden bodied coal wagons with steel underframes using some Slater's wagon kits combined with Airfix mineral wagon underframes. These were inspired by a batch that were obtained in the mid 1960s for internal use at the Ponders End gas works.
DSCF1312.jpg

There is little point in starting to build many new wagons from kits when I also have a good many wagons acquired from several sources in varying states of disrepair, part / failed conversion etc. and have been working my way though a good many of these in an attempt ultimately to obtain usable vehicles.
One concession I make is if I require a few more of a particular type of wagon than I have in the acquired pool then I will add some from my kit stockpile.
Such was the case with this batch of tube wagons.
DSCF2316.jpg

The three on the left were acquired and the two on the right new kits progressed to the same stage before continuing as a batch.
Regardless of condition nothing is tried on the layout without a visit to the works for a thorough check first.

The most recent products of the wagon works are these, which required most of the underframe detail adding.
A BR insulated meat van. This was originally painted white and excess handling has resulted in the white paint showing through on some high spots.
DSCF1310.jpg

And this pair of ex LNER plywood vans with different types of brake gear.
DSCF1311.jpg

You may note that a visit to the paint shop is due. All in good time.
Regards
Tony.
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