Neil B Workbench

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nberrington
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Neil B Workbench

Postby nberrington » Mon May 22, 2023 9:24 pm

Victoria Day long weekend brought about some fiddle-zen with some Masokits bits and bobs. Had a wee dram to honour the celebrated sovereign!

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Last edited by nberrington on Mon Feb 26, 2024 2:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

nberrington
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby nberrington » Thu Jun 22, 2023 1:21 am

Moving along with the Masokits chassis - whew - that’s a lot of bits and bobs and scratching the old noggin.

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nberrington
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby nberrington » Sun Jul 02, 2023 2:10 am

There was a bit of a ”teaser” in my request for Masokits underframe instructions.

I started a Chivers kit of a Southern Special Cattle van. I had posted it elsewhere, and Mr. Chivers himself weighed in as follows:

“There’s more prototype information about it today than when I produced the kit. It all started when I did the BY, I was repeatedly asked for the Utility Horse Box. As it happened for many years Mike and I had adjacent stands at ExpoEM. Oh, he laughed, they must mean this and gave me the drawing. I’ve no idea why they built the second batch, every branch bay platform seemed to have one in.”

I thought it a wonderful story. Anyway - here’s the progress to date:

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John Palmer
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby John Palmer » Sun Jul 02, 2023 6:44 pm

Mike King has written that the ten SCVs built at Lancing for BR(S) were intended as replacements for the ten SCVs then surviving that had been constructed for pre-Grouping constituents of the Southern. There is a useful set of photographs of these later, electrically-lit vehicles at https://collection.sciencemuseumgroup.org.uk/objects/co205892/british-railways-special-cattle-van-1951-cattle-van-railway-wagon, which also confirms the absence of the end steps fitted to the initial 1930 batch to gain access to the rooftop oil lamp. As Chivers etchings provide for these steps, the 1930 version is probably the easier choice for representation in model form..

Mike writes that the 1930 vehicles were withdrawn between 1961-63, but the BR-built versions soldiered on until withdrawal between 1966 and 1971. I was fortunate enough to snap one of the later batch in its final years on a passing freight train, but the picture quality wasn't good. For a long time I thought it was an ex-GW Beetle; recognition of the differences only gradually dawned on me.

Hope you get as much pleasure from building this kit as I have had from making other kits from the Chivers range, and that you'll post pictures showing further progress. And you might want to think about saving that Masokits representation of the clasp brake gear for another Southern wagon rather than cannibalising it for use on the SCV!

nberrington
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby nberrington » Sun Jul 02, 2023 9:35 pm

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A pleasant Sunday afternoon doing some detail. RSU’s rule!
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nberrington
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby nberrington » Sun Jul 16, 2023 10:25 pm

So the Chivers SR Special Cattle Van is now on its feet. Bedford sprung W irons on a PalatineModels base plate and Ultrascale wheels - sooth as silk.

Busy with the details and chassis bits.

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essdee
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby essdee » Mon Jul 17, 2023 10:12 am

Lovely work Neil!
Look forward to seeing this when completed.

Steve D.

nberrington
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby nberrington » Tue Aug 08, 2023 3:09 pm

Some recent work - just door springs and some white metal fitting to do. A suitable groom has been recruited and is posing in the compartment …

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Noel
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby Noel » Tue Aug 08, 2023 5:47 pm

The stockman needs to be able to inspect the stock he's travelling with, and may need access to them in transit. GWR Beetles had two fixed corner seats, with a flap seat on a sliding door into the stock area between them, plus a second sliding door opposite the first into the other stock compartment. The pre-restoration photo in https://collection.sciencemuseumgroup.org.uk/objects/co205892/british-railways-special-cattle-van-1951-cattle-van-railway-wagon does seem to have a doorframe similarly located. I think the half plan in Gould may be incorrect.
Regards
Noel

nberrington
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby nberrington » Tue Aug 08, 2023 9:36 pm

The middle compartment arrangement is certainly different from a regular horse box, where this style of bench seating works. I assumed there must be some kind of door, but the drawing I had showed this arrangement. (Although quite a bit smaller - only 4 foot across)

It isn’t visible at all really, and I made the dividing walls principally as roof support (Hence the spacing.) . I put some cursory interior in for the halibut as an afterthought. I suppose eventually the fellow might just be visible inside once the lid goes on.

As it is I’ve spent way to long on the project, but was having fun....
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John Palmer
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby John Palmer » Tue Aug 08, 2023 11:04 pm

Some further resources:
https://www.deviantart.com/rlkitterman/art/BR-Special-Cattle-Van-S-37335-566925759: 1951 batch
https://www.flickr.com/photos/124446949@N06/49679384766: 1930 batch
https://www.railwaymuseum.org.uk/sites/default/files/2018-05/Southern-Railway-Carriage-Wagon-Drawings-List.pdf: SR C&W drawings list: a number of these relate to the SCV design
https://hmrs.org.uk/hmrs-5877--special-cattle-van.html: HMRS reproduction of the Eastleigh drawing showing lettering arrangements.

Seems clear from the photographs that there is a door frame in both of the drover compartment partitions, so I think Noel must be correct about the drawing in Gould (also in 'Illustrated History of Southern Coaches') being in error regarding this detail.

As I expected, this is emerging as an excellent model of an attractive and comparatively uncommon prototype; look forward to seeing the finished vehicle.

martin goodall
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby martin goodall » Wed Aug 09, 2023 8:02 am

One question that has always puzzled me is the livery applied to these vehicles by the SR. I have seen some models painted SR freight stock brown, and others painted in SR olive (later malachite) green. Which is correct? [Or might SR practice have changed or varied?] I do not have it immediately to hand at the moment, but I recall an oblique photo of one of these SR vehicles taken on the K&ESR showing a fairly shiny paint finish, so presumably a recently applied coat of passenger green?

The next question is - if they were painted green, what colour was the "S R" on the side - white or yellow?

I have never succeeded in getting my hands on one of the old Chivers kits, so this question remains academic for me, but it was a vehicle that was always on my wish list.

John Palmer
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby John Palmer » Wed Aug 09, 2023 9:10 am

Martin, a definitive answer to your question can probably be found in the volume of the HMRS publication 'Southern Style' that deals with the pre-nationalisation period, but unfortunately I have only the volume covering the post-nationalisation period so canot refer to it - perhaps someone else can help on this score? However...

A copy of the Eastleigh drawing showing the lettering arrangement to which I provided a link on the HMRS site also appears in Mike King's 'Illustrated History of Southern Coaches'. Close scrutiny of the HMRS site's reproduction of this drawing revealed its prescription of black ends and grey sides (and roof) - which came as a surprise, until I read Mike's explanation that the drawing was Amendment 4 dating from 1942 "which altered the bodywork colour from Maunsell green to grey". Evidently this was a wartime measure applied to livestock vehicles, but at least one SCV did not receive this grey treatment and thus remained in Maunsell green until arrival of the nationalised regime. The majority of the body side insignia was rendered in yellow, with the exception of the 'XP' and wheelbase brandings, which were in white, judging by the photograph of the SCV that retained green livery until 1949 and which appears at Plate 22 in 'Illustrated History'. Under Amendment 4 at least, most underframe insignia was in white, exceptions being the 1" high vehicle number and the word 'BRAKED' just to the right of the footboard, both of which were in yellow.

I had hoped that my copy of the original HMRS LSWR/SR livery register might shed some light on the composition of the grey body livery, but unfortunately there's nothing more than a brief mention of the wartime grey livery. However, the Register does give some additional paintwork details, indicating that the roofs of the 1930 batch were white, and the following information on interior colours: droplight and fixed light frames - grained teak, groom's compartment - stained oak with white ceiling, cattle compartments - stone colour, and (a vital final detail) steam heater and its guard - purple brown (SR drawings E 19144 and E 19145, dated February 1930).

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Noel
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby Noel » Wed Aug 09, 2023 11:12 am

John Palmer wrote: with the exception of the 'XP' and wheelbase brandings, which were in white

Some SR Banana vans also show this; they may have been a later addition as suggested in SR Wagons V4, or, possibly, the result of RCH standardisation. They seem to have appeared during 1938 for new construction and were in black if the rest of the lettering was, matching later practice.
Regards
Noel

nberrington
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby nberrington » Wed Aug 09, 2023 1:06 pm

Thanks all for the excellent information! Good thing I haven’t started painting it yet !
Mk1 of my laser cut “roof kit” just off the laser cutter 15 minutes ago:
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nberrington
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby nberrington » Sat Aug 12, 2023 8:30 pm

My plastic version of the roof was pathetic - so I used as a template and fan-dangled a nice brass one in the trusty GW roller. (The one torpedo vent needs reseating - cameras are cruel)

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nberrington
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby nberrington » Mon Oct 02, 2023 9:33 pm

Summer is officially over, and sadly my 21 year old Bowmore is also finished….

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On a positive note I’m now back at the workbench. Started work on some Chiver’s Tunnys. The Rumney chassis is a work of art and a pleasure to work with

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nberrington
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Re: Neil B Workbench

Postby nberrington » Sun Feb 25, 2024 10:02 pm

Back to the workbench….

Having seen Mr Oldfield take on two dozen Petroleum Coke hoppers for Mostyn, I dare not complain about a covey of ballast wagons now can I?

The Rumney chassis have a lot of little bits…..
Just saying…..

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