First steps in P4- now on my second loco

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pete_mcfarlane
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby pete_mcfarlane » Mon Jul 10, 2017 4:21 pm

I sprayed it with etch primer from a Halfords can followed by handpainting with Valejo acrylics. All the bearings, hornblocksand moving bits were carefully masked off with a mix of tape and copydex, and survived the experience without being gummed up with paint.

With rigid OO chassis I've sprayed the whole thing with no masking and cleaned out the bearings afterwards.....

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pete_mcfarlane
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby pete_mcfarlane » Mon Aug 21, 2017 9:11 pm

I now have a working loco. The pickups were a bit of a fiddle - they're attached to the brake gear, and after trying the method suggested by Tim Shackleton in his MRJ article on this kit (glue slivers of copperclad to the cross rods) I went for a more robust method. I've soldered some copperclad sleeper strip behind the pull rods, where it doesn't show, and then soldered the pickups to that. It's carefully gapped around the bits where it's soldered to the cross rods.
DSC_0015_4.JPG

It's looking slightly tatty in that photo as it's not been fully painted, plus the brake gear had to come off and on a few times before all shorts were eliminated. I used to build locos before owning a multimeter - I've no idea how I managed to get them short free without it.

So after a bit of tweaking and adjustment of the motor torsion bars to limit the movement of the motor (the flywheel was grinding against a frame spacer) I now have a loco that glides smoothly up and down my test track as well as the ancient Hornby controller (birthday present in about 1984) I'm using to test things allows it.

Apologies for the slightly weird look of this photo, as I have a new phone and haven't yet got the hang of it.
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IMG_20170820_175556.jpg (146.51 KiB) Viewed 3432 times


It's now going off the be painted.

I've also found time to finish this - another Bill Bedford wagon - this time a Midland 3 plank dropside. This was pretty straightforward - the only real issue was that the body had a slight twist to it, which was removed by heating it in warm water and them twisting back to shape. Fox transfers for the letters (the HMRS sheet for LMS pre-group wagons seems to be impossible to find) and a laser printed numberplate.
DSC_0007_5.JPG

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Allan Goodwillie
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby Allan Goodwillie » Mon Aug 28, 2017 5:28 pm

Hi Pete,

Your loco is coming along well and I am sure you have had much pleasure out of building it. In my case I used wafer thin copper clad material now available from Eileen's and stuck that to my keeper plate. The brake gear is also attached to this to allow for ease of access to the motor/gearbox and axles.

DSC02189.JPG
Sorry it looks a bit rough and ready

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pete_mcfarlane
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby pete_mcfarlane » Sat Dec 09, 2017 10:34 pm

After what feels like an eternity, here's another update. Modelling progress has been slow - a few hours here and there every week, but I've got the Barclay painted, and nearly complete.

It was sprayed with my newish Iwata Neo airbrush, which I'm slowly getting the hang of, over a coat of etch primer from a Halford spray can, lined with a cheap ruling pen, and varnished using a Tamiya matt varnish spray can (because I've yet to master airbrush varnishing). Paint was from Valejo.

Worksplates, and nameplates (as the fictitious 'Peak Mines No. 1') were from narrow planet, and a suitable Edwardian Loco Crew came from Aidan Campbell. It's currently waiting for cab roof to be attached with PVA, and then final assembly. I'm rather pleased with it, although I've yet to fully tested the chassis out to make sure it can cope with prolonged running.
IMG_20171209_220401.jpg

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Le Corbusier
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby Le Corbusier » Sat Dec 09, 2017 11:11 pm

good effort Pete :thumb
Tim Lee

Julian Roberts
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby Julian Roberts » Sun Dec 10, 2017 6:37 am

Fantastic Pete.
On first glance I thought you'd suddenly produced another loco! It somehow looks bigger with all that lining like my dog makes herself look bigger when she feels scared!
Hope running continues to go as well as this. Above you said you had it gliding perfectly.

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Allan Goodwillie
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby Allan Goodwillie » Sun Dec 10, 2017 10:26 am

Yes Pete, :)

Lovely! It is amazing the effect that various liveries have on the proportion of a locomotive. Hope to see this running some day with all the nice wagons you have been building.

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Andy W
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby Andy W » Sun Dec 10, 2017 12:37 pm

That's got great character. Looks lovely.
Make Worcestershire great again.
Build a wall along the Herefordshire border and make them pay for it.

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pete_mcfarlane
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby pete_mcfarlane » Sun Dec 10, 2017 5:02 pm

Thanks for the comments.

It's a good point about the livery - it does make it look a lot more robust looking than it was in it unpainted state.

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pete_mcfarlane
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby pete_mcfarlane » Sun Jun 24, 2018 9:07 pm

I'm not sure why it took another 6 months, but the Barclay is now finished. It's a little noisier than I'd like but ran pretty smoothly both on my own short length of track and the more complicated NAG test track. I suspect the noise is a down to how I've mounted the motor more than anything else - the gearbox has been stripped down and reassembled and shows no obvious problems.

But anywhere, I now have a P4 loco that works - fully compensated, with outside cylinders and a boiler I rolled myself. I'm rather pleased. Next up will be another industrial - a Judith Edge Kitson long boiler.

IMG_20180624_190701.jpg
IMG_20180624_190656.jpg
IMG_20180624_190648.jpg
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Le Corbusier
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby Le Corbusier » Sun Jun 24, 2018 9:10 pm

Well done Pete ... excellent progress and another feather in the cap for us beginners :thumb
Tim Lee

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Allan Goodwillie
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby Allan Goodwillie » Mon Jun 25, 2018 6:01 pm

Yes Pete, :)

well done, it is not unusual to take some time over a loco - it is probably what happens to most of us as we get embroiled in other things my own thread on building Barclays has come to a halt as I have been busy building the layout they are meant for and now that has been delayed as I have been working on two group layouts because of recent exhibitions. Just par for the course. :thumb

It is all looking good.
Allan :)

David Knight
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby David Knight » Mon Jun 25, 2018 11:00 pm

Nice work, Pete! I’ve been tempted bybthem for some time. Just as a matter of curiosity, what would the power rating of these engines be, 2F, 3F ?

Cheers,

David

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pete_mcfarlane
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby pete_mcfarlane » Tue Jun 26, 2018 12:13 pm

I'd have thought these would be a 1F or 2F in the BR scheme, although I can never understand how these power classifications were arrived at.

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Noel
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby Noel » Tue Jun 26, 2018 1:18 pm

As always with unfitted stock involved, the issue was more likely to be how much can it stop, rather than what can it pull...
Regards
Noel

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Allan Goodwillie
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby Allan Goodwillie » Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:54 pm

Hi Noel :)

you are right to a degree. The big Barclays were designed to be able to haul 40 wagons plus brake up the entire line which had a major gradient coming up from the Wellesley Colliery (Methil, Fife) as well as the MIchael Colliery.

The Barclays had 22,403 lb at 85% efficiency which would suggest a BR power class of 3F (if they had one at all). For example the ex-LNER class J83 - which they took on loan once was17,744lb BR power class 2F and the J94 class (several of which were also bought for use on the Wemyss system) was tractive effort 23,870lb and BR power class 4F)

The power classification depended on a number of things as well as the steam available, size of cylinders, wheels etc, went together as a combination. Some times locomotives did not fulfil their potential simply because of the inadequacy of the brakes, an example from op this neck of the woods was the N15 which the NBR hoped would do much of the coal haulage, however in the end it tended to do trip shunting and less onerous work.

There were recommendations given by the inspectorate which meant that the Barclays should only pull a max of 36 wagons, mainly because of braking down the grades I would think. Part of the operation on the line required the pinning down of brakes and if trains were being worked without Brake vans a man or men were carried in the last couple of wagons in the train to pin down brakes before the trains went down grade - interesting to witness. Sorry I have no photographs of the practice, but a daily sight on the line.

Incidentally there was a design offered by Barclay for a 0-8-0T design, which I quite fancy building just for the hang of it - rated at TE-36,833lb and another for an 0-6-6-0T design TE-38,862lb neither of which were ever built, in fact I have never seen a drawing of the latter, however there is a good drawing of the 0-8-0T design in the book that is available on the railway.

Allan :)

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pete_mcfarlane
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby pete_mcfarlane » Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:44 am

Thanks for at Alan - that's a really interesting post. What would the 0-6-6-T have been? A Mallet or Meyer, or possibly a pair of smaller engines back to back?

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Noel
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby Noel » Sat Jun 30, 2018 1:49 pm

Allan Goodwillie wrote:The power classification depended on a number of things as well as the steam available, size of cylinders, wheels etc, went together as a combination


As with the late GWR large panniers. The boiler pressure and leading dimensions of all three classes were the same, and so was the TE therefore, but when the ex-LMS system was applied by BR, the 57XX were 3F, the 94XX and 15XX were 4F, presumably because of the weight differences.
Regards
Noel

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pete_mcfarlane
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby pete_mcfarlane » Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:37 pm

That mention of panniers in the last post leads nicely on to my second attempt at a P4 loco - the Judith Edge kit for a Kitson Long Boiler 0-6-0 pannier tank. This will be finished as another freelance industrial.

Here's the result of a few evenings work, including a couple at NAG. Sorry about the iffy photo, but my camera phone has changed it's behaviour and doesn't take as good close up photos as before (you've got to love these software updates in the background).

IMG_20180921_225923.jpg


The basic footplat and cab assembled were first, and I'm now working on the chassis. It's been a doddle so far, as the kit is really good. For starters it's in nickle silver, which makes it a lot quicker to assemble compared to brass (as I can hold bits without my fingers melting, rather than having to work out how to hold bits of brass in place to solder them together). Everything pretty much fits with no work beyond removing the remains of the etched tabs.

The only problem I've had was down to me soldering the cab too far forward, as there's no indication where the front sheet goes. Presumably a couple more trial runs and closer study of the diagram would have avoided this, so that's my fault rather than the kit. It was a few minutes work to unsolder and move it to the correct place.

I've followed the instructions pretty closely, although I'm soldering on more of the detail to the chassis before fitting the wheels, as I like to paint the chassis before wheeling up. I'm planning to use the provided compensation - this caused some head scratching at NAG the other week as nobody had encountered anything like it before, but it looks viable and I trust Mike Edge's design.

There are a few very nice features in the kit that are worth a mention - it comes with two chassis, one for P4 wheels with scale(ish) flanges, and one with slightly more generous spacing for OO/EM wheels. I was also impressed that the instructions list exactly which Gibson wheel, Mashima motor and High Level gearbox to use - aren't we supposed to guess these things and then struggle to get them to fit....?

My one criticism is the inclusion at the back of the instructions of a couple of pages of drawings of all the other kits they do, so you I've ended up like an 8 year old with the Hornby catalogue (want that one, and that, and that, and that....).

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pete_mcfarlane
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby pete_mcfarlane » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:51 pm

After some helpful advice on RMweb (http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index. ... ?p=3307559) I formed the tanks around a block of wood. I got the dimension of the inside of the tanks from the etched tank end (which fits inside them). After much dithering, the actual process of bending was straightforward and only took a few minutes.

IMG_20181122_165548.jpg


So I now have the basic body completed. I did deviate from the instructions and soldered the reach rod in place before the tanks, to make it easier to solder in place. The rod needs to be (prototypically) bent to get around the springs.

IMG_20181212_221642.jpg


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My only real problem with the body was bending the smokebox wrapper. this needed a small bit of filing to get it all to fit (or possibly I'd misinterpreted the instructions). Not that you can see much of it, under the tanks. I also modified the tank tops to match the photos of the preserved loco, which are completely flat with no curve in to the boiler.

The chassis, with it's compensation arms, has been painted and the arms soldered in to place. they are mounted on pins, and held in place with small sections of 0.6mm I/D tubing from Eileen's Emporium. I struggled to cut 2mm slivers of this until I tired using a slotting file (narrow file designed for making slots in small screw heads, and also useful for clearing etched slots in kits) to do the cutting.

This shows the compensation being tested on my Poppy's chassis jig.
IMG_20180927_193125.jpg


And this shows how the arms are held in place, with the tube.

IMG_20181212_221311.jpg


Next steps are to fit the wheels. This kit is taking a while to build due to lack of spare time, rather than any real issues with it.

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Le Corbusier
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Re: First steps in P4- moving on to my first P4 loco

Postby Le Corbusier » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:56 pm

pete_mcfarlane wrote: This kit is taking a while to build due to lack of spare time, rather than any real issues with it.


I know that feeling only too well ... still, progress looking good Pete :thumb
Tim Lee


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