Southern 8' Steam Bogies

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garethashenden
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Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby garethashenden » Tue Mar 07, 2017 5:44 pm

In my never ending to-do pile I have a Southern Queen Mary brake van. It's the Bachmann model and I converted it to EM by replacing the bogies with a pair from No Nonsense Kits. They are cast whitemetal sides with an etched rigid frame. I'm like to upgrade these to sprung or compensated (sprung preferably) bogies but I'm not sure exactly what I need. I would like to try to reuse the side frames unless there's a really good reason not to, so I think I'm looking for an etched kit of just the inner frames. I've seen things like this for other bogies, BR, LNER, etc. but I don't think I've come across any for Southern bogies.

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kelly
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby kelly » Tue Mar 07, 2017 6:05 pm

One option perhaps is keeping the cast sides, and replacing the innards with the branchlines (iirc?) compensated coach bogies, available in various sizes.
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Andy W
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby Andy W » Tue Mar 07, 2017 6:09 pm

Brassmaster comp units I think.
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kelly
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby kelly » Tue Mar 07, 2017 6:12 pm

Andy W wrote:Brassmaster comp units I think.


That'll be the one, I couldn't remember who it was. I know they offer various sizes from 7ft through to iirc 10ft, including 8ft and 8ft 6". If using whitemetal sides then the type inbetween doesn't matter as much really.
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kelly
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby kelly » Tue Mar 07, 2017 6:13 pm

These being what I was originally referring to.
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garethashenden
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby garethashenden » Tue Mar 07, 2017 6:50 pm

Thanks, that looks promising.

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Guy Rixon
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby Guy Rixon » Tue Mar 07, 2017 6:58 pm

The Bill Bedford range includes sprung bogies to 8' WB. Both the "pre-group SR 8' and the "Fox 8' " look like they would work. (In fact they look identical on a first inspection.)

bevis
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby bevis » Tue Mar 07, 2017 7:53 pm

I've used Bill Bedford units for most of my stock with good results. They are available from Eileen's without any cosmetic frames so your original plan should work. You might need the secondary springing units as well but they are easy to retro-fit.

CornCrake
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby CornCrake » Wed Mar 08, 2017 7:19 pm

I recently dusted off some old part built BSL/Phoenix Southern 4-COR coach kits and wanted to complete.

I had the unmade white metal parts for 4 pairs of SR 8' steam bogies and 1 pair of 9' dummy power bogies.

I wanted a cost effective solution to provide either equalisation or springing, and so ordered some Scalefour Society Coach Compensation Unit kits (CCU) at £3-50 a pair. (9' code 222, 8' code 224)

These duly arrived, although without the rivets or the silver steel wire. A quick email to stores and the rivets duly arrived, and I just used some brass wire instead of the silver steel wire.

Apparently mine was the first sale in about 10 years!

Still they were easy to fold up and solder, and then having thinned the back of the bogie side castings and enlarged the hole in the back of the axle, before gluing them to the CU, the resultant bogies are working well.

The website has now been amended to indicate "etch only", so you have to source your own rivets or use some other means of attaching the bolster to the bogie.

I assume that they are not selling because better "mousetraps" have been invented?

Steve

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Will L
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby Will L » Wed Mar 08, 2017 11:08 pm

CornCrake wrote:...I assume that they are not selling because better "mousetraps" have been invented?


You could say that. They work OK but don't produce a very free running coach so the number you can pull will be limited.
The MTJ torsion bar units produce a much more free running bogie, but they are dependant on solder joints on the torsion bar which tend to be unreliable. The Palatine Models conversion kits over comes this problem but for the moment the MJT bogies seem to be out of stock.
In my view the Bill Bedford sprung units are the way to go, but given the short wheelbase of bogies, a fully rigid bogies will do on good track work so long as allow enough movement between coach and bogies.

CornCrake
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby CornCrake » Thu Mar 09, 2017 12:07 pm

Before adding the compensation levers (which bear directly on the axles) the bogies were free running to the extent that if I raised the 120cm test plank by 2 cm at one end a bogie on its own rolled down the track, and seemed to give adequate track-holding ability, navigating through my scissors crossover.
Adding the pivot wire and levers(which you can only do once you have riveted the bogie to the bolster) did impair the free running, but I have not performed the same test yet.
I am almost tempted to omit the compensation, would that be a cardinal sin?
Steve

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Will L
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby Will L » Thu Mar 09, 2017 4:58 pm

CornCrake wrote:I am almost tempted to omit the compensation, would that be a cardinal sin?


On your sole be it. But you will need to fix the pinpoint bearings central in the slot they run in or the bogie will ride too low. They do run free in a slot yes(? I ask because my expedience is of the D&S variant which I'm pretty sure was a strait copy of the Scalefour original). Getting the whole thing perfectly flat and square with the bearings all at exactly the same level (de rigueur if you want them to stay on) might not be all that strait forward.

One of the advantages of compensation/springing is that any minor variations from perfectly true and flat really don't matter much, even in P4

Alan Turner
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby Alan Turner » Thu Mar 09, 2017 11:14 pm

Will L wrote:
CornCrake wrote:I am almost tempted to omit the compensation, would that be a cardinal sin?


On your sole be it.


Dover or shoe?

regards

Alan

Philip Hall
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby Philip Hall » Fri Mar 10, 2017 12:13 am

If you decide that rigid bogies are the way to go, you could not do better than the Hornby ones fitted to the Maunsell coaches. They are far and away the best representation of these bogies available, particularly if you replace the moulded tie rod with wire. However, I could be wrong as to exactly how available they are as spares...

Philip

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kelly
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Re: Southern 8' Steam Bogies

Postby kelly » Fri Mar 10, 2017 12:29 am

Philip Hall wrote:If you decide that rigid bogies are the way to go, you could not do better than the Hornby ones fitted to the Maunsell coaches. They are far and away the best representation of these bogies available, particularly if you replace the moulded tie rod with wire. However, I could be wrong as to exactly how available they are as spares...

Philip



A quick search suggests not at all at present.
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