Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Includes workshop practice, painting and weathering, model photography etc.
best33
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 12:05 pm

Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby best33 » Sun Feb 09, 2020 8:53 am

I have three 3500 gallon tenders on the go at the moment and I have built them so the wheels can be fully removable for painting and other maintenance.

The kit is designed for the wheels to be fitted permanently.

In order to make the brakes removable I have fitted a small spigot in the frames where the upper brake pivot goes and then fitted a small tube to the outer face at the top of the brake hanger. Once the lower cross shaft is fitted the brakes can spring between the frames to retain them.

I made the tube to the correct length by drilling a hole in a block of metal and after cutting the tube over length fitting it in the hole and filing it flush to the surface. I then drilled another hole to the exact depth of the spacer and then put the tube in that hole with the end not yet filed at the top and filed that flush with the top.

I used a sleeve on the drill with the required amount of drill bit protruding at the end to drill the hole to the required depth.

I removed the completed bush from the hole with a broken broach and carefully removed the swarf. I did enough if these for 15 tenders! This method was much quicker than turning each one.

The next problem was getting the brake block aligned with the wheel so I made a jig to do this. Hopefully the following pictures make this clear.

Mark
Attachments
76AC94EB-EAA9-417B-81B3-1B3E546FB78E.jpeg
Completed bushes
76AC94EB-EAA9-417B-81B3-1B3E546FB78E.jpeg (28.59 KiB) Viewed 1976 times
A9ECAE9B-ABE8-48D8-AD4B-DB9826DAD555.jpeg
Bush filed flush to top of block
A9ECAE9B-ABE8-48D8-AD4B-DB9826DAD555.jpeg (25.12 KiB) Viewed 1976 times
74DE908E-8F8A-47C8-8D62-BD0462A647D4.jpeg
Removing bush from hole with broken broach
74DE908E-8F8A-47C8-8D62-BD0462A647D4.jpeg (20.57 KiB) Viewed 1975 times
AC6962DF-2516-4A10-8C50-D742643A96BC.jpeg
Drilling hole to required depth using sleeve
AC6962DF-2516-4A10-8C50-D742643A96BC.jpeg (25.5 KiB) Viewed 1975 times
66937167-F3C2-4F50-B447-B7C1D4F9DA2E.jpeg
Fitting sleeve to drill. Make sure the standout of the bit to the start of the taper is the required hole depth
66937167-F3C2-4F50-B447-B7C1D4F9DA2E.jpeg (28.98 KiB) Viewed 1976 times
ED4F0EAF-06C1-455F-BC99-680CACDA71D2.jpeg
Brake block components pre assembled prior to soldering
ED4F0EAF-06C1-455F-BC99-680CACDA71D2.jpeg (29.6 KiB) Viewed 1976 times
CE2C6150-8737-401A-B02F-D7EB295228A3.jpeg
Brake block alignment jig. The disc is 17mm diameter. The holes were positioned using the hole centres from the kit for the axle and brake pivot. The recess allows the inside face of the hanger to be flush with the surface of the block so the brake shoe stays flat.
CE2C6150-8737-401A-B02F-D7EB295228A3.jpeg (27.46 KiB) Viewed 1975 times
DE2EFDEC-E896-4822-9F96-5765B17D76C2.jpeg
Checking the two sides are parallel. I found it best to solder the shoe to the spindle first and then to tin the inside of the hangers. I soldered from the top side and then removed the assembled brake to carefully solder the other side
DE2EFDEC-E896-4822-9F96-5765B17D76C2.jpeg (24.04 KiB) Viewed 1975 times
CE31FBAE-0CC7-40E2-806A-41CB81BB0F73.jpeg
Final check that everything is aligned
CE31FBAE-0CC7-40E2-806A-41CB81BB0F73.jpeg (26.26 KiB) Viewed 1975 times
175FF4DC-81EB-4471-9D6F-3C26EB4B1177.jpeg
Assemble brake
175FF4DC-81EB-4471-9D6F-3C26EB4B1177.jpeg (30.18 KiB) Viewed 1976 times

User avatar
Serjt-Dave
Posts: 392
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 3:31 pm

Re: Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby Serjt-Dave » Sun Feb 09, 2020 10:09 am

Very clean and methodical work there Mark.

All Best

Dave

essdee
Posts: 422
Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2008 4:47 pm

Re: Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby essdee » Sun Feb 09, 2020 11:33 am

Wonderfully simple jig for the bushes, Mark - I have slaved over many a set of those without thinking of doing that! Those are superb double-hanger assemblies - very well done, thanks for posting. I will shortly have seven loco chassis brake assemblies under construction, in 'staggered parallel', so will adopt these ideas as valuable time-savers....

Steve

User avatar
Will L
Posts: 1797
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2008 3:54 pm

Re: Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby Will L » Sun Feb 09, 2020 1:24 pm

best33 wrote:...In order to make the brakes removable I have fitted a small spigot in the frames where the upper brake pivot goes and then fitted a small tube to the outer face at the top of the brake hanger. Once the lower cross shaft is fitted the brakes can spring between the frames to retain them.

I made the tube to the correct length by drilling a hole in a block of metal and after cutting the tube over length fitting it in the hole and filing it flush to the surface. I then drilled another hole to the exact depth of the spacer and then put the tube in that hole with the end not yet filed at the top and filed that flush with the top.


Have to agree that removable wheels and brake gear are the way to go and you seem to be making a very neat and tidy job. I've often need short lengths of tube for exactly this sort of job and I've found a nice easy way of cutting of the bits of tube I needed. The quick and easy way to cut small tube is to role it under s sharp craft knife. The result is a clean end that shouldn't need cleaning up. If you press too hard you can close the tub up just a touch but this doesn't matter so long as the tub isn't to close a fit on the wire that goes through it in the first place. I can cut rings 0.5mm long off the end of a tube without to much difficulty which come in very handy when attempting plumbing details. I generally start with the tube against a steel rule so I can measure how much I'm cutting off. If your worried about 1/10 of a mm and repeatbility you can use an end stop jig to ensure they are the right length and all the same. The most difficult bit is stopping the cut off bits pinging away and self sacrificing themselves to the Grear Carpet God.

best33
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 12:05 pm

Re: Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby best33 » Sun Feb 09, 2020 2:48 pm

Yes I have used this method before. To stop the bits firing off across the room I used to push a piece of wire inside the tube to trap them!

Here are some more pictures showing the completed brakes and one temporarily balanced on its spigot.

Mark
Attachments
D787BEFA-AF5D-4187-BC3E-1FF35ED50DD8.jpeg
Temporarily fitted to the chassis
D787BEFA-AF5D-4187-BC3E-1FF35ED50DD8.jpeg (102.42 KiB) Viewed 1878 times
441821A3-A150-4862-A8B0-E0296241F7A3.jpeg
18 brakes!
441821A3-A150-4862-A8B0-E0296241F7A3.jpeg (140.4 KiB) Viewed 1878 times

DougN
Posts: 996
Joined: Wed Sep 01, 2010 9:57 am

Re: Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby DougN » Sun Feb 09, 2020 10:20 pm

What is the length of the tube you are using or how did you come up with it?

I ask as I need to do the brake gear on the V2's (again batch building) I need to find a way that works for me as I keep struggling with brake gear that works, (when I dont want it too!)
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

best33
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 12:05 pm

Re: Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby best33 » Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:40 am

The tube basically sets the distance from the frames to the brake hanger so it will different for a different kit or prototype. In this instance I think it was 0.8mm. I first used this 20 years ago. I built a 28xx and made the brakes removable by not soldering the hangers to the pivot. Since they were double hangers again you had to engage quite a lot of the hanger. I found the brakes got damaged and the pivots used to get bent so I decided to make the pivot project no more than 0.5mm from the outside of the frames and arrange for a brass tube to locate over it and space the brakes. This prevents the pivot being bent and the amount of deflection needed to sprung the brake assembly off is quite small.

Mark

DougN
Posts: 996
Joined: Wed Sep 01, 2010 9:57 am

Re: Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby DougN » Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:36 am

Thanks Mark that is great information. I will have to make some time to look over the problems I can foresee on the V2's :thumb
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

User avatar
Horsetan
Posts: 1076
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2008 9:24 am

Re: Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby Horsetan » Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:17 pm

DougN wrote:....I keep struggling with brake gear that works, (when I don't want it too!)


A slight irony in that the system described here actually makes the brakes look as though they could be made to operate....
That would be an ecumenical matter.

best33
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 12:05 pm

Re: Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby best33 » Mon Feb 10, 2020 1:05 pm

It is useful to build them so they can be moved for final adjustments but to make them so they can operate; No Thanks!!!!!

Mark

best33
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 12:05 pm

Re: Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby best33 » Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:49 pm

Here are some pictures of a dry run fitting of the brakes.

You can also the end of a spring in the last picture but that is another story!!

Mark
Attachments
5497B642-E28B-4141-B178-9038C072C29E.jpeg
Back of tender
5497B642-E28B-4141-B178-9038C072C29E.jpeg (80.67 KiB) Viewed 1668 times
5057184D-ACF0-4F69-A22B-271AE12B3623.jpeg
Side view
5057184D-ACF0-4F69-A22B-271AE12B3623.jpeg (113.54 KiB) Viewed 1668 times
250DA47F-C5BA-4D27-9DA9-2EA21CE5F0D5.jpeg
Position of spacer
250DA47F-C5BA-4D27-9DA9-2EA21CE5F0D5.jpeg (112.12 KiB) Viewed 1668 times
424F1240-F263-4DCB-AF93-5E1ACB12D004.jpeg
Once the cross shaft is soldered in place the hangers Will be located hard against the frames
424F1240-F263-4DCB-AF93-5E1ACB12D004.jpeg (124.19 KiB) Viewed 1668 times
852C6E37-F4C7-4D92-A272-23BAE2C8266C.jpeg
Close up of spigot
852C6E37-F4C7-4D92-A272-23BAE2C8266C.jpeg (106.36 KiB) Viewed 1668 times

IANATEXTON
Posts: 48
Joined: Sun Feb 20, 2011 10:12 pm

Re: Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby IANATEXTON » Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:06 pm

Mark,
Thanks for this - very helpful, and lovely work.
I have several Finney tenders to build, so I am looking forward to the next part of the story, about springing.
Ian

DougN
Posts: 996
Joined: Wed Sep 01, 2010 9:57 am

Re: Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby DougN » Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:18 am

The next tender I have to do is a LNER Group standard and that will be sprung rather than the compensated as I find the sprung tenders run more smoothly.

Have the spring/ bearings been fabricated or are you using the holders from David Bradwell and I think the Scalefour soc stores? I have a collection (though I dont know where off the top of my head but they will turn up again!)
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

best33
Posts: 28
Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 12:05 pm

Re: Finney 3500 Gallon Tender Brakes

Postby best33 » Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:44 pm

I drew up some spring carriers and reaction blocks for the tenders based on the Bill Bedford principle. The middle carrier accommodates a top hat bearing. All I had to was to modify the tender frames so that the rigid axle hole was elongated. The other modification was to remove 0.3mm off the length of the pin point axle to accommodate the extra width of the carriers between the frames. I also had to reduce the boss on the outside of the wheel to get enough clearance. It is tight but it does work.

39457C7E-C27B-419D-B185-B65508E271DA.jpeg
Sufficient spring reaction parts for two tenders
39457C7E-C27B-419D-B185-B65508E271DA.jpeg (94.6 KiB) Viewed 1513 times
3AEC26FD-9342-4D63-AC62-E607047FBC14.jpeg
Etched parts for springing units. The rectangular pieces go in the corner at the top of the frame
3AEC26FD-9342-4D63-AC62-E607047FBC14.jpeg (130.26 KiB) Viewed 1512 times
3AEC26FD-9342-4D63-AC62-E607047FBC14.jpeg
Etched parts for springing units. The rectangular pieces go in the corner at the top of the frame
3AEC26FD-9342-4D63-AC62-E607047FBC14.jpeg (130.26 KiB) Viewed 1512 times
Attachments
3CA31CDE-DB33-4462-8FFB-3BBDE1CE173E.jpeg
Carriers in position
3CA31CDE-DB33-4462-8FFB-3BBDE1CE173E.jpeg (107.85 KiB) Viewed 1512 times
991BA2F5-6FC8-40A8-9B79-D75F433224F1.jpeg
991BA2F5-6FC8-40A8-9B79-D75F433224F1.jpeg (111.01 KiB) Viewed 1512 times
8E073BB9-B10F-424F-B104-FCF9804FBA96.jpeg
8E073BB9-B10F-424F-B104-FCF9804FBA96.jpeg (138.57 KiB) Viewed 1512 times
CE641797-D2DD-4308-8E9C-4749162FE235.jpeg
Spring reaction points positioned on frames. The spring goes in the gap between the etched part and the frames
CE641797-D2DD-4308-8E9C-4749162FE235.jpeg (94.47 KiB) Viewed 1512 times


Return to “Tools and Techniques”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest