New C&L Crowdfunding Project for P4 Plain Track

Discuss the prototype and how to model it.
Armchair Modeller
Posts: 1131
Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2011 7:34 pm

New C&L Crowdfunding Project for P4 Plain Track

Postby Armchair Modeller » Tue Jul 30, 2019 2:53 pm

C&L seem to be attempting a crowdfunding project for new flexitrack bases for plain track in EM and P4.

All here

https://www.clfinescale.co.uk/online-st ... p140950737

garethashenden
Posts: 282
Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2015 9:41 pm

Re: New C&L Crowdfunding Project for P4 Plain Track

Postby garethashenden » Tue Jul 30, 2019 3:37 pm

They're crowdfunding this on their own website rather than somewhere like Kickstarter? Hmm... Given how hard it seems to pay them that might not be the best idea. It seems like an invitation to confusion and unhappy customers. One of the major attractions of services such as Kickstarter is that they provide good ways of updating all the backers at once about the progress of the project. No indications are given here of how much needs to be raised or when it is likely to be delivered.

I have no problems with crowd funding projects in general, but badly managed ones hurt everyone. They can very quickly erode trust that has taken years to build.

User avatar
grovenor-2685
Posts: 3175
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2008 8:02 pm

Re: New C&L Crowdfunding Project for P4 Plain Track

Postby grovenor-2685 » Tue Jul 30, 2019 4:44 pm

See for example the Dave Jones threads on RMweb. It has to be done properly.
Rgds

User avatar
David B
Posts: 1115
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2008 5:30 pm

Re: New C&L Crowdfunding Project for P4 Plain Track

Postby David B » Tue Jul 30, 2019 5:19 pm

There is no target date, nor does it say what one gets for their £150. My only experience of crowd funding was something my wife did for a book where she was promised a copy. The suggested donation was about 10% above the copy retail price which would have been considerably more than the cost of the book but there was a demand for the book in it's niche market.

Does one get anything out of this C&L project - some track, a discount, cup of coffee?

dal-t
Posts: 624
Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 8:06 pm

Re: New C&L Crowdfunding Project for P4 Plain Track

Postby dal-t » Tue Jul 30, 2019 10:15 pm

It appears you get 20M of track for your £150 - too difficult for me to work out if that is a fair price or not, I tend to work in hundreds of chairs and metres of sleeper strip, as per the Stores order form. But what really confuses me is whether 75% of the required costs (whatever they are) have to be met for P4 and EM separately, or whether a combined cost has been calculated (in which case, what happens if 90% of the crowdfunding comes from one or other gauge - is the other one dropped, or does it get a relatively 'free' ride?). I agree entirely that these things need to be sorted properly, and contributors should be kept properly informed. That, as I understand it, is the benefit of crowdfunding sites. This go it alone approach seems fraught with difficulty.
David L-T

Alan Turner
Posts: 551
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2008 4:24 pm

Re: New C&L Crowdfunding Project for P4 Plain Track

Postby Alan Turner » Wed Jul 31, 2019 7:05 am

dal-t wrote:It appears you get 20M of track for your £150 - too difficult for me to work out if that is a fair price or not, I tend to work in hundreds of chairs and metres of sleeper strip, as per the Stores order form. But what really confuses me is whether 75% of the required costs (whatever they are) have to be met for P4 and EM separately, or whether a combined cost has been calculated (in which case, what happens if 90% of the crowdfunding comes from one or other gauge - is the other one dropped, or does it get a relatively 'free' ride?). I agree entirely that these things need to be sorted properly, and contributors should be kept properly informed. That, as I understand it, is the benefit of crowdfunding sites. This go it alone approach seems fraught with difficulty.



Well that's £7.50 per m. Peco is £3 per m. In other words you are getting nothing for your risk.

Let the saga of DJ Models be your guide.

regards

Alan

User avatar
Noel
Posts: 1143
Joined: Wed Jun 23, 2010 1:04 pm

Re: New C&L Crowdfunding Project for P4 Plain Track

Postby Noel » Wed Jul 31, 2019 8:57 am

Alan Turner wrote:Well that's £7.50 per m. Peco is £3 per m. In other words you are getting nothing for your risk.


A fairer comparison is with the OO version https://www.clfinescale.co.uk/online-store/NEW-CODE-75-BULLHEAD-FLEXITRACK-OO-16-5-MM-60-FOOT-TRACK-PANELS-SELF-ASSEMBLY-WITH-HI-Hn-Nickle-Silver-Rail-2-Meter-PACKS-p135282908. The higher price for the OO is probably down to 2M vs 20M. His flexitrack [a different product] is £6.60 https://www.clfinescale.co.uk/online-store/FLEXITRACK-OO-16-5-MM-STEEL-Rail-1-X-Meter-p128178289, which is more directly comparable with Peco.
Regards
Noel

Philip Hall
Posts: 1305
Joined: Mon Aug 10, 2009 7:49 pm

Re: New C&L Crowdfunding Project for P4 Plain Track

Postby Philip Hall » Wed Jul 31, 2019 4:19 pm

The £3.00 per yard price relates to Peco Streamline code 100. Their bullhead flexitrack, comparable to C&L, particularly with regard to the thickness of the sleepers, is £5.00 per yard. The EMGS track, made by Peco, is £5 per yard, the same price as the standard 00, but admittedly only available to EMGS members. So the proposed C&L is still substantially more expensive, notwithstanding that you get a few more inches for your money.

I find it also very interesting that C&L are proposing to make flexitrack with keys facing one way or the other, like (I think) the Peco/EMGS product, something that seems not to have been possible before.

Since the Exactoscale FastTrack bases are still available, I wonder at the economics of this. They are, though, using hi-ni rail, and we know that there have been difficulties with this rail fitting existing chair and track mouldings because of a thicker web. At least this new moulding should solve that problem. I solved it by using up a large stock of (quite old, 20 years maybe) ordinary nickel silver rail, which slid through the FastTrack bases much more easily than more modern rail, but not everyone will want to put up with the slightly yellow tinge of standard nickel silver!

Philip

Knuckles
Posts: 1208
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2011 9:15 pm

Re: New C&L Crowdfunding Project for P4 Plain Track

Postby Knuckles » Sat Sep 28, 2019 10:58 am

Personally I dispise with a passion the golden look of standard NS rail so Hi Ni or Steel is all I will consider.

As to the crowd funding project.

Err.

Ok.

Opinionation / Opination: (even a word?)

We have at least two options for building quicker plain line that I know about already. C&L shallow sleepers and Exactoscale full depth sleepers.

It's RTPlonk P&C that is the real head turner, game changer and pisser offer of traditionalists. If you want to make waves, there's your go to.

Quite happy to build track, not built loads but quite enjoyed it and got it to work so all good. If RTP stuff comes along though and it's suitable for what's in mind it may be used.
“He who dares not offend cannot be honest.” Thomas Paine

http://www.shapeways.com/shops/sparksho ... eationsscc
Mostly offering Loco kits & bits in 4mm.
SCC Photon Resin Prints Price list
download/file.php?id=19320

User avatar
jim s-w
Posts: 1725
Joined: Wed Jul 30, 2008 5:56 pm

Re: New C&L Crowdfunding Project for P4 Plain Track

Postby jim s-w » Mon Sep 30, 2019 9:52 am

Philip Hall wrote: They are, though, using hi-ni rail, and we know that there have been difficulties with this rail fitting existing chair and track mouldings because of a thicker web.
Philip


Is it bad that I’ve never noticed any difference? :?


Return to “Track and Turnouts”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest