Starting over again ...

Making room for a layout, where and how?
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John Bateson
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Starting over again ...

Postby John Bateson » Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:21 am

Since I retired just over 10 years ago, work on the 'magnum opus', which was started twenty years ago when I was 50, has proceeded in fits and starts. Very little has been done in the 10 years since retirement to progress towards a fully working and decorative completion, due to a number of other interests intervening and taking up appreciable amounts of my time. The latest of these relate to aged parents and their insistence on their independence, which is becoming irrational, taking up an enormous amount of intervention from The Lady Downstairs and me, the result being that over the past year, she and I have had no time for our usual, all-consuming hobbies.
Therefore it is time to make some rational and considered decisions.

The current layout is in the attic, accessible through a loft ladder. In a further 10 years it will not be accessible at all since my arthritis is beginning to be a real nuisance and both knees and shoulders will soon require some surgical intervention. Access to the attic will have to be abandoned and with that all the base units. The Lady Downstairs and small daughter plan that we should plunder the savings bank and build during the next twelve months, at the bottom of the garden, a 3m x 5m garden office, the rear wall of which will become the new, 'not-so-magnum opus' and thus a much simpler and more achievable project.

Accordingly I am offering to the forum, the items shown in the attachments, at zero charge, but collection and some assistance in dismantling being required.All the tables have adjustable legs and are fully primed inside and painted or varnished on the visible parts. The actual layout parts sit on top of these and use dowels to locate into the table cross pieces, these are not on offer at the moment since I hope to preserve some of them.

Tables For Disposal 1.JPG
Total size is 5.49m x 3.26m

Tables For Disposal 2.JPG

Tables For Disposal 3.jpg

3D Plinth 05.JPG
Typical layout box without outer support walls
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Philip Hall
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Philip Hall » Tue Feb 25, 2014 1:41 pm

John,

I wish you well in all this. It's actually quite close to home, because we (the Boss and I) have decided that I should relocate to the bottom of the garden into a 'garden studio'. In my case it is because trying to increase the size of the loft workshop was going to be horrendously expensive, so for less money and more space it seemed the way to go. I shall miss not merely being able to go upstairs to work - or play, come to that!

The bonus, for Heather at least, is that she will gain the use of the loft for her pursuits and hobbies. Maybe that's why she's keen on the idea...

Philip

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Rod Cameron
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Rod Cameron » Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:00 pm

Do I detect a trend in getting shunted down to the end of the garden?

Despite the weather, I'd sooner be there than in the loft. Good luck with it John.

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Rod

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Andy W
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Andy W » Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:53 pm

That looks wonderfully civilised Rod.
Make Worcestershire great again.
Build a wall along the Herefordshire border and make them pay for it.

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jayell
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby jayell » Tue Feb 25, 2014 4:01 pm

Rod Cameron wrote:Do I detect a trend in getting shunted down to the end of the garden?


A very nice chalet workshop.

But I'd be worried about it being broken into, obviously the risk of this will depend on where you live and how accessible the garden is. Garden sheds/workshops are, generally speaking, too easy for thieves to get at.

John Lewis

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Tim V
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Tim V » Tue Feb 25, 2014 4:31 pm

I understand your situation John.

I have come up with an even more radical plan to cope with the problem of a lack of practical space - but I daren't mention it here for fear of getting lynched :!:
Tim V
Scalefour News Editor

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Penrhos1920
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Penrhos1920 » Tue Feb 25, 2014 7:38 pm

Tim V wrote:I understand your situation John.

I have come up with an even more radical plan to cope with the problem of a lack of practical space - but I daren't mention it here for fear of getting lynched :!:


You've consigned SWMBO to the garden chalet and you're converting the whole house into a railway room.
Getting it Alright

Penrhos Junctions near Caerphilly - Barry Rly, Rhymney Rly and A(N&SW)D&R 1920 and pseudo modern image in S4F
and
Awrhyllgwami for DEMU challenge
and
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and
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Trevor Grout
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Trevor Grout » Tue Feb 25, 2014 8:49 pm

What a good idea, however the slight flawin that one was the expensive divorce that goes with :D

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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Trevor Grout » Tue Feb 25, 2014 8:53 pm

Rod Cameron wrote:Do I detect a trend in getting shunted down to the end of the garden?

Despite the weather, I'd sooner be there than in the loft. Good luck with it John.

P1020242.JPG


P1020234.JPG


P1020251.JPG


One is impressed of the strategic use of scalefour merchandise in almost every picture Rod.
nice clean shed, but, how will theviaduct fit in I wonder..... :shock:

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Rod Cameron
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Rod Cameron » Tue Feb 25, 2014 11:30 pm

Tim V wrote:I have come up with an even more radical plan to cope with the problem of a lack of practical space - but I daren't mention it here for fear of getting lynched :!:


You're going 2mm? :mrgreen:
Rod

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Rod Cameron
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Rod Cameron » Tue Feb 25, 2014 11:34 pm

Trevor Grout wrote:nice clean shed, but, how will theviaduct fit in I wonder..... :shock:


Yes, clearly I haven't done much modelling lately Trevor ... :(

And the viaduct won't be stored here although I could probably work on one or two sections.
Rod

John Fitton

Re: Starting over again ...

Postby John Fitton » Wed Feb 26, 2014 12:06 pm

About 7 years ago we moved into a much larger two-storey house with an unfinished basement, and my railway is about 25x8 feet, and becoming a double deck. My wife has suggested in about 5 years we "retire" into a bungalow of about the same size, so my railway should have a 50% increase in available area. Only problem is when I started building my present one portability definitely wasn't one of the criteria!! Out with the chain saw!!

All the best John!

Philip Hall
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Philip Hall » Wed Feb 26, 2014 12:46 pm

Looks a lovely place to work, Rod. Given the English weather, I'm intrigued how you keep snug, as there doesn't appear to be a lot of insulation. And what sort of heating do you use?

Philip

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jayell
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby jayell » Wed Feb 26, 2014 3:37 pm

Philip Hall wrote:Looks a lovely place to work, Rod. Given the English weather, I'm intrigued how you keep snug, as there doesn't appear to be a lot of insulation. And what sort of heating do you use?


The walls probably have a couple of inches of insulation behind that nice timber panelling but the roof could do with lining with upwards reflecting foil to reduce heat penetration in the summer, plus insulation and cladding.

The chalet clearly has a proper mains power feed so underfloor heating may have solved the problem of keeping it warm in winter, but there is no obvious means of ventilation other than the entrance door.

John Lewis

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Rod Cameron
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Rod Cameron » Wed Feb 26, 2014 7:27 pm

Philip Hall wrote:Looks a lovely place to work, Rod. Given the English weather, I'm intrigued how you keep snug, as there doesn't appear to be a lot of insulation. And what sort of heating do you use?

Philip


Thanks Philip (sorry John I seem to have hijacked your thread a bit)

There are inner and outer walls with insulation between, total thickness about 135mm. Floor and roof also insulated, windows and doors double glazed, windows can open. If you want to check further it's a Dunster House Avon 500.

This is my work office as well. I laid armoured cable under the path beforehand and power comes from the consumer unit in the garage. For heating I only use a small portable convector heater with thermostat control left on tickover - to date it's never been less than 10 degC when I walk in in the morning, and I can get it to 18 or 19 within 15 minutes or so with the odd boost during the day to keep it comfortable.
Rod

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John Bateson
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby John Bateson » Wed Feb 26, 2014 7:30 pm

Rod,
No worries about the hijack - I have been following the conversation with some considerable interest. Dunster House seem to be top of my list at the moment.

But perhaps to remind other readers, the boards in the original post are still available...

John
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Trevor Grout
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Trevor Grout » Wed Feb 26, 2014 9:12 pm

Rod Cameron wrote:
Trevor Grout wrote:nice clean shed, but, how will theviaduct fit in I wonder..... :shock:


Yes, clearly I haven't done much modelling lately Trevor ... :(

And the viaduct won't be stored here although I could probably work on one or two sections.[/quote

did you require planning application for the shed Rod?

I am thinking of extending my shed, from25ft x 12ft perhaps squezze another 3ft in the lengrh and nearly 8ft in the depth, already amour cabled and also cat5 directly in there. The real pain in walking 65ft to get there! As I type this Mrs G, s head pops over theside if the tablet reads and then exclaims "oh, really, you think so do you....." which deciphered from womancode mean no chance. Spose I will have to tidy it up instead..... :shock:

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Rod Cameron
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Rod Cameron » Wed Feb 26, 2014 10:31 pm

No planning permission needed in my case Trevor. The building (they now call them PremiumAvon or something, but mine is nominal 5m x 3m) comes under the 2008 permitted development rules and is under 2.5m high so can be close to the boundary, and is well less than 50% of the garden area.
Rod

Trevor Grout
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Trevor Grout » Wed Feb 26, 2014 11:08 pm

Rod Cameron wrote:No planning permission needed in my case Trevor. The building (they now call them PremiumAvon or something, but mine is nominal 5m x 3m) comes under the 2008 permitted development rules and is under 2.5m high so can be close to the boundary, and is well less than 50% of the garden area.


I am sure mine is somewhat higher than that, mind you is was built before 2008 rules applied. I seem to remember something about 11ft from ground to apex...

Terry Bendall
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Terry Bendall » Thu Feb 27, 2014 8:43 am

John Fitton wrote:when I started building my present one portability definitely wasn't one of the criteria!! Out with the chain saw!!


This of course is one of the problems of building a layout that is not intended to be taken to exhibitions. Even if you don't intend to do this, making it possible to move the layout, should the need arise, without destroying it in the process is always a good idea. Things do change and it is helpful to anticipate this if you can.

Terry Bendall

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LesGros
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby LesGros » Thu Feb 27, 2014 9:56 am

Terry Bendall wrote:
... Even if you don't intend to do this, making it possible to move the layout, should the need arise, without destroying it in the process is always a good idea...
This is the approach I have taken with FooteryNeuk; the built-in storage/bench-work will remain as an asset to the building, but the layout is planned to be in sections hinged to the under-frame to allow access for both construction and maintenance. Alas, progress has been stalled for a while due to illness and a number of other distractions. :(
LesG

The man who never made a mistake
never made anything useful

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John Bateson
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby John Bateson » Sat Oct 04, 2014 1:56 pm

It has been a while since the last post, but some progress is being made. Part of that progress has been made as a result of a small inheritance (not the aged, irrational couple mentioned in an earlier post).
The shed/man-cave/garden office/escape hole is now well and truly on the planning board. With a 'U' value the same or slightly better than a modern timber framed house structure the expected heating costs for a year are expected to be £130 for a 5m x 4m structure.

Part of the outstanding issue relates to insurance. Investing a largish sum of money in this garden office has directed my mind to insurance and Direct Line have thrown a huge wobbly. They have not only declined to cover the garden office but have endorsed my insurance so that it no longer covers anything at all in the garden. To cap it all, they also say that no premium reduction is being allowed. This means that all the stuff in the shed has had to be moved to the garage - where it is still covered!
Apparently this sort of hissy fit from house insurers is becoming more common.

Without wishing to advertise, another firm seems to have been far more helpful. A small increment of £30 on the current payment is acceptable to me.

There are, it seems, some specialist firms that are beginning to cover these sorts of buildings and I have as yet to discover how much they cost. But at the moment, although companies cover "buildings" as main house and out-buildings, the moment you say it is a garden office and will hold some small hobby style machine tools the panic sets in.

Still, progress of a sort nontheless

John
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Terry Bendall
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Terry Bendall » Sun Oct 05, 2014 8:39 am

John Bateson wrote:Part of the outstanding issue relates to insurance


My house insurers - Halifax, cover everything that is in my garden workshop without any extra premiem. The firm of brokers that we use for our exhibition cover, Magnet Insurance see www.modelrailwayinsurance.co.uk may be able to assist since they specialise in the area and for those who may be interested in live steam models as well.

Terry Bendall

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John Bateson
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby John Bateson » Sun Apr 12, 2015 8:43 am

It has been a while since the last post, but the latest saga with the shed/gardenoffice/workshop has been with Welsh Water. We have a surface water drain manhole cover right in the far corner of the garden so as a courtesy I contacted them just to check how much clearance they might need should they ever need to access it.
Since the maps did not correspond with the physical location they eventually got a team (Christmas Eve) to come and check things over and their conclusions were that the building could go ahead since there were essentially no foundations and access could be easily provided either from the adjoining footpath or the play area simply by removing fence panels and therefore I could go ahead once they had delivered the revised drawings to Welsh Water.
Accepting this was a big mistake, the drawings are somewhere in the ether to this date and filling the net with messages saying 'will you please respond to my email of such and such date' etc was getting frustrating. We submitted a variation of the original plan, much smaller and hit the same impasse, nobody would reply.
And finally, after the cost of the building had gone up by several hundred pounds, I got an offer of compensation from Welsh Water for £20 and acceptance of the smaller plan. I suspect I might just return the £20 and ask them to find an alternative use for it - and yes, that is a euphemism!

But, the landscaper is now booked, deposit paid of the 'shed' (Dunsterhouse) and we may even see it finished by end June.
Fingers crossed.

John
Slaving away still on GCR stuff ...
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Philip Hall
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Re: Starting over again ...

Postby Philip Hall » Sun Apr 12, 2015 1:25 pm

John, interesting to hear how you are getting on.

After some months of prevarication/ inactivity in my part, we submitted plans to the local authority and were told a fair while later that yes, we did need planning permission (it's going to be 6.7m x 6.2m) after all. So these plans are now in (I'm so glad I enlisted the aid of a friend who is well versed in all this stuff and produced all the drawings with CAD) and we await developments. It's helpful that there is a garage there at the moment, which will need to be demolished, so although the building is bigger it will be lower, so all the neighbours are in favour. Once we are into building, the actual removal of my workshop down the garden is a bit frightening, at times I wish I just had a toolbox and a desk!

I have also just renewed our house insurance and the broker confirmed that a 'hobbies room' down the garden was within the policy provisions, but did agree that when the layout is up and many valuable locomotive and other models were in there we might need to review matters. So it does seem that different companies have different views on this sort of thing.

Philip


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