Advice on a shed for a layout

Making room for a layout, where and how?
Philip Hall
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby Philip Hall » Wed Jun 02, 2021 8:48 am

David,

I like the ducted vacuum system, never heard of that before. Is it an Australian thing? Must save lugging vacuum cleaners around!

I decided that it would be good to get away from the internet in the workshop and it has probably been a good idea. The mobile gets me out of trouble if I need something. The Faraday Cage problem manifests itself with the phone as well, but the door is a few steps away.

Tony, I do use your sign idea, but still drivers, Amazon in particular, just ring, dump and go!

Philip

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Will L
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby Will L » Wed Jun 02, 2021 9:49 am

Ok why has nobody mentioned the Internet doorbell option, which would allow you to see and speak to anybody at your front door? Or are we all to concerned about the mass surveillance security issues these devices seem to be attracting? While on that topic of security, my wife would be horrified if I suggested leaving a note on the front door saying we weren't at home.

As an aside, my youngest has one of those internet devices which has proved that there are deer living in the suburbs of Romford.

Philip Hall
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby Philip Hall » Wed Jun 02, 2021 1:36 pm

I wouldn’t leave a sign if we weren’t at home, only if I was down the garden. Internet doorbells are interesting, drawbacks as well as pluses there.

Philip

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Martin Wynne
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby Martin Wynne » Wed Jun 02, 2021 10:03 pm

All this electrickery. Not needed.

"If no answer, pull this string."

String pulls an old hammer off the shed roof, it falls in a tin bucket.

No electrics, no batteries, nothing to go wrong. :)

Martin.
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dclift
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby dclift » Thu Jun 03, 2021 12:08 am

Philip Hall wrote:I like the ducted vacuum system, never heard of that before. Is it an Australian thing? Must save lugging vacuum cleaners around!

I believe that they are called “central vacuum systems” in the U.K. though I have never seen one installed there.

Martin Wynne wrote:All this electrickery. Not needed.
String pulls an old hammer off the shed roof, it falls in a tin bucket.

This looks like an excellent system but my wife would not let me climb onto the roof to reset the hammer. Could you automate that? :D
David Clift.

nigelcliffe
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby nigelcliffe » Thu Jun 03, 2021 6:34 am

Philip Hall wrote:David,

I like the ducted vacuum system, never heard of that before. Is it an Australian thing? Must save lugging vacuum cleaners around!



Our house has one (Scottish Borders), as do the 33 neighbours by the same builders, motor unit on the wall inside the attached garage. Local legend says the builder went to Canada, saw one, and thought that's a good selling point for the more upmarket end of their house builds.

Perhaps £1000 to buy and install at build time - we've got four hose connection points, plus an under-counter sucker in the kitchen. Expensive to install retrospectively (needs ducting of about 2in diameter around house).
Cheap to run: one bag in the motor unit does several years.
The cleaning flexi-hose might be the weakness: the handle on ours needs a repair (which I can probably do at home), but a replacement flexi+handle is the most expensive part, costing more than a new Henry cleaner.

For a workshop, the under-cupboard sucker ducts might be the way to go, then you sweep stuff to the sucker and it disappears.
But, spending my money on a new workshop building, I'd just get a Henry, possibly a wet&dry capable version, and make a cupboard to keep it inside.


- Nigel

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Guy Rixon
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby Guy Rixon » Sat Jun 05, 2021 10:27 am

Will L wrote:Ok why has nobody mentioned the Internet doorbell option, which would allow you to see and speak to anybody at your front door? Or are we all to concerned about the mass surveillance security issues these devices seem to be attracting? While on that topic of security, my wife would be horrified if I suggested leaving a note on the front door saying we weren't at home.

As an aside, my youngest has one of those internet devices which has proved that there are deer living in the suburbs of Romford.


Reasons not to use an Internet Of Traps doorbell.

- If it's cheap(-ish), it will break, either in hardware or in software. If you need to use it with atypical phones (e.g. old iPhones) or computers (Mac, Linux) it may be DOA.

- If it's expensive, it will route its information through a premium service on the supplier's server. That means it won't work when your internet access is down, and it will stop working permanently if the supplier withdraws the service (which has happened in at least one case).

- If it's Amazon, it will share your internet access with complete strangers, which could have interesting consequences. This is literally Amazon's plan for their devices going forward; I think it's a misguided attempt to get round poor connectivity for the IoT devices.

- It will be insecure. The only question is whether it will be it will laughably insecure from day one and you can't fix it because the manufacturer doesn't patch, or whether you'll need to patch it frequently as the subtle bugs are found and fixed.

I see little in the consumer IoT that isn't skipware. And don't get me started on the voice-op thingies: "Alexa, record an embarrassing conversation and randomly send it to some of my contacts".

However, it would be possible to build one's own video entry-phone that doesn't have those problems.

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Noel
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby Noel » Sat Jun 05, 2021 11:25 am

Guy Rixon wrote: If it's Amazon, it will share your internet access with complete strangers, which could have interesting consequences. This is literally Amazon's plan for their devices going forward; I think it's a misguided attempt to get round poor connectivity for the IoT devices.


Which would seem to ignore the possibility that any such 'strangers' are themselves concerned about malicious outsiders and have therefore put adequate security in place to prevent any such contact. Or am I missing something?
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Noel

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Guy Rixon
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby Guy Rixon » Sat Jun 05, 2021 12:25 pm

Noel wrote:
Guy Rixon wrote: If it's Amazon, it will share your internet access with complete strangers, which could have interesting consequences. This is literally Amazon's plan for their devices going forward; I think it's a misguided attempt to get round poor connectivity for the IoT devices.


Which would seem to ignore the possibility that any such 'strangers' are themselves concerned about malicious outsiders and have therefore put adequate security in place to prevent any such contact. Or am I missing something?


IIUC, doing so would disable the Amazon device on the more-secured household. But perhaps it's cleverer than that.

The purpose of this feature is for the Amazon devices of neighbours to share internet connections so that they are never off-line. The risk is that an attacker will bring in a device that pretends to be neighbour. AFAIK, there's nothing to stop an Amazon device in a white van from joining the sub-net.

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Winander
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby Winander » Sat Jun 05, 2021 1:32 pm

Can’t say I’m over the moon about my hive heating control connecting to my local.network without any authentication.
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Martin Wynne
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby Martin Wynne » Sat Jun 05, 2021 2:46 pm

Martin Wynne wrote:All this electrickery. Not needed.
"If no answer, pull this string."
String pulls an old hammer off the shed roof, it falls in a tin bucket. No electrics, no batteries, nothing to go wrong. :)
Martin.

Or

"If no answer, turn this tap on."

Hosepipe sprays a jet of water at the shed window. No electrics, no batteries, nothing to go wrong. :)

Easier to set up than the string, and you get your tomato plants watered at the same time.

Martin.
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Mike Paterson
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby Mike Paterson » Thu Sep 07, 2023 7:49 pm

Just a few things to add. My shed is 18 x 8 feet. Fully insulated with 2 inch kingspan and lined with 4mm ply on the walls and inexpensive wickes cladding on the roof. It has a couple of thermostatic controlled heaters. I have both mirror film and el-cheepo roller blinds at the windows to keep out the world's vulgar gaze. To aid security I have replaced the hinges screws and hasp with bolts backed with penny washers and nyloc nuts. There is also a mortise lock fitted. Best of all though is that I have an exceptionally nosey neighbour.

One thing I soon discovered was that the windows were steaming up. This was reduced significantly by adding a bathroom extractor fan from screwfix, nothing fancy just a basic manrose job.This comes on with the lights.

The other big thing I added was a small desicant type dehumidifier, this drains through a pipe in the shed wall. This has worked well and keeps surface rust at bay.

I have recently put interlocking rubber/foam tiles on the floor. Makes the shed quieter, warmer and easier on the feet.

My shed also has a solar powered builge pump because the concrete was poored on a mega hot day in august and they could not level it in time. So the concrete pad has a sump with the pump in it to remove my winter puddle.

andrewnummelin
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby andrewnummelin » Fri Sep 08, 2023 7:50 am

Mike Paterson wrote:...

One thing I soon discovered was that the windows were steaming up. This was reduced significantly by adding a bathroom extractor fan from screwfix, nothing fancy just a basic manrose job.
...

One thing I forgot to mention in my earlier post was that we had double glazed window units fitted that incorporated trickle vents: the result was that there never was any condensation problem.
Regards,

Andrew Nummelin

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jon price
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Re: Advice on a shed for a layout

Postby jon price » Fri Sep 08, 2023 11:44 am

All the excellent advice on this thread has come to naught. We aren't moving. so the grand plan is now a much reduced micro. Still it has more chance of being completed. Also after sawing the board in half I now also have the shortest layout based on the Chester to Holyhead line ever made. A twelve foot fiddle yard at each end and it would be complete. The signal posts here would almost be as tall as the line is long.

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