A possible new P4 wheel source

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Proto87stores

A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby Proto87stores » Fri Jun 28, 2019 4:23 pm

My main P:87 wheel supplier, NWSL is shutting down due to personal reasons. It's not yet clear if the business will be taken up by a new owner. Or just disappear :(

In order to protect my wheel availability I've started experimenting with my existing CNC production system in order to be able to manufacture my own P:87 wheels. However, since I'm also interested in having and running my own UK models, It's not a difficult step to also include a few 4mm P4 versions of wheels in that system.

Image

So I thought it would be worth sharing my early adventure with creating a UK coach wheel set. This crude hand made sample isn't a production item (yet), but I would expect to be able to churn them out in quantity and fairly economically some time after September, if any others were interested. This particular test piece is 1.6 mm wide, as it is intended to run on my P:87 16.5 mm gauged track. But a 1.8 mm wide version would be just as easy to produce, although, apart from possible excessive gauge widening, 1.6 mm should otherwise operate perfectly on P4 track.

One of the potential advantages for me is to be able to provide a more integrated and even less costly source of complete P:87 and P4 bogies with optimized working suspension, in both plain and powered versions.

Andy

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zebedeesknees
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Re: A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby zebedeesknees » Mon Jul 01, 2019 12:53 pm

I can confirm that P87 wheels work fine with S4 track, and therefore probably with P4. I have been using wheels from the now defunct 'Railflyer' source, which look very similar, for some time. The insulating bushes came for 2mm or 1mm axles, and I have used both. Their 40" diameter wheel in P87 equates to 35", or a worn 3' in 1:76.2. They measure 1.7mm wide, so I would have no qualms about using these from Andy.

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Horsetan
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Re: A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby Horsetan » Mon Jul 01, 2019 11:19 pm

Proto87stores wrote:..... to protect my wheel availability I've started experimenting with my existing CNC production system in order to be able to manufacture my own P:87 wheels. ....


Wouldn't say no to those, Andy. Is your CNC system able to produce tyres for those who want to use their own wheel centres?
That would be an ecumenical matter.

Proto87Stores

Re: A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby Proto87Stores » Tue Jul 02, 2019 10:14 pm

The wheel post was actually supposed to be a reply to the "REF: Rail wheel profile and "to do" list update" Topic. For me, they would be another case of the Nickel Silver/Nickel Silver Nadal friction value testing and demo running that Will appreciated.

I'm afraid I can't contemplate making rims only for others. I expect the considerable labour set up time vs. small batch quantity would be a very uneconomic ratio. So I'm focusing just on plain disc wheels for now. And I already have "many miles to go before I rest" on just those plans.

Andy

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Guy Rixon
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Re: A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby Guy Rixon » Sun Aug 04, 2019 5:33 pm

Andy, have you considered wheels as shown, but with inserts to represent Mansell wheels? A shallow recess turned into the front could hold an etched or printed insert.

proto87stores

Re: A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby proto87stores » Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:34 am

Andy, have you considered wheels as shown, but with inserts to represent Mansell wheels? A shallow recess turned into the front could hold an etched or printed insert.


Yes and yes. But I don't have any drawings (or pictures) for those. Hopefully someone will publish a link to some.

I just have a few more tram track sections to complete and then I'm back onto power trucks and all the varieties thereof. The N7 chassis should pop up sometime in October at the slow rate I'm going. After that I' have the challenge of a fully equalised chassis for my L1's. (2-6-4T's).

Andy

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kelly
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Re: A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby kelly » Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:03 pm

Inserts for BFB wheels might be of use, with the forthcoming Model Rail Class 12 shunters, the SR/Bulleid ones had bigger BFB wheels.
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proto87stores

Re: A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby proto87stores » Tue Aug 06, 2019 4:01 pm

BFB wheels area distinct possibility. How many people would be interested in those for the various SR prototypes, pacifics, Q's etc?

Andy

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Horsetan
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Re: A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby Horsetan » Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:45 am

proto87stores wrote:BFB wheels area distinct possibility. How many people would be interested in those for the various SR prototypes, pacifics, Q's etc?

Correct Q1 domed face wheel centre would help.
That would be an ecumenical matter.

shipbadger
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Re: A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby shipbadger » Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:02 am

I have both Q1 and light pacifics in need of wheels.

Proto87Stores

Re: A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby Proto87Stores » Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:34 pm

My initial main focus is going to be P87/P4 compatible coach and emu wheels. Including the working suspension bogies and power trucks that use them.I discovered after my earlier wheel posting that there already are Gibson Merchant Navy wheels, so no need for me to attempt them. I assume a similar situation will arise for Q1 wheels, If it has not already done so.

Since I'm the original P8:87 SIG stores, I'm not a dealer and so don't do reselling, nor make non-relevant things purely for profit, except where a simple adaption or design variation from P:87 parts, allows them to be useful for other scales. Making those provides a needed subsidy for ongoing Proto:87 operations and new development. The Stores is modelled on the intended similar purpose of the Scalefour Stores, but has no Society supporting it, and hence no dues to provide any income. The Proto-87 movement is widely but thinly scattered world-wide, and could not survive on purely P:87 sales alone.

Andy

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Horsetan
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Re: A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby Horsetan » Thu Feb 13, 2020 12:13 am

Proto87Stores wrote:...I assume a similar situation will arise for Q1 wheels, If it has not already done so. ...


It hasn't :roll:
That would be an ecumenical matter.

Philip Hall
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Re: A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby Philip Hall » Thu Feb 13, 2020 12:47 pm

Andy, it would perhaps be more helpful to say that the Alan Gibson wheel for the SR Q1 is incorrect, in that the face of the moulding is flat. The prototype is actually slightly domed and the tyre sits slightly proud of the centre. Hence the requests, from time to time, for a better wheel. I believe that the wheel for the Merchant Navy and WC/BB also has a slightly incorrect crank throw, but not enough to worry about.

Philip

Proto87stores

Re: A possible new P4 wheel source

Postby Proto87stores » Thu Feb 13, 2020 9:02 pm

Thanks for the extra info. Since I''m not at all knowledgeable in the area of most prototype steam locomotives, I should probably stay away from considering making wheels for them.

Andy


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