Scaleforum 2013

Announcements, recommendations, visit reports etc. Discussion of the Society's own shows.
DougN
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby DougN » Tue May 14, 2013 9:12 pm

Horsetan wrote:Maybe we should have the show in Ireland. Then almost everyone would have to travel. ;)


My comment is still Singapore, Hong kong or Dubai... only one leg on a plane for me! :D

Seriously though as Terry has rightly pointed out there is the cost of staging the show and the location should always be at X to keep some members happy... there will always be others who want it at Y... So it is coming down to availability and cost... less so the location. I think every one who can make it should be happy and grateful that so many people give their time for nothing to stage for our enjoyment!

Sorry to say I can't make it this year no matter how much I ask SWMBO... there seems to be higher priorities than a week in the UK.
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

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Paul Willis
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Paul Willis » Tue May 14, 2013 10:00 pm

DougN wrote:
Horsetan wrote:Maybe we should have the show in Ireland. Then almost everyone would have to travel. ;)


Sorry to say I can't make it this year no matter how much I ask SWMBO... there seems to be higher priorities than a week in the UK.


See you next year then Doug!

Surely she can't be _that_ mean???

;-)
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Trevor Grout
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Trevor Grout » Tue May 14, 2013 10:07 pm

Just a thought

if stoke mandaville has a high speed broadband connection available, perhaps a few stratigic wireless webcams might be setup, for those who cannot realistically get there to soak up the show from afar.


regards
trevor

Terry Bendall
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Terry Bendall » Wed May 15, 2013 6:08 am

Natalie Graham wrote:I appreciate the argument that the present location appeals to a majority of members and that there are not so many members further North, but is there perhaps a counter argument that having the society's premier showcase event in the south of the country discourages or, at least, fails to attract, those further away?


This of course will always be the situation regardless of where Scaleforum is held and it has been aired on here several times in the past. In addition Danny has published information on the number of members living in the different regions of the UK. We also know that Scalefour North is really Scalefour Not Very Far North At All. In the end we have to be practical and choose a venue that will be accessible for the majority. Every year we do get visitors from Scotland and the north of England and we do get some visitors from overseas. At Scaleforum last year one of our members, who lives near Hastings was expressing concern at the move which would give him a longer journey - and that of course is justrified. About half an hour later I was talking to another member who had driven from Aberdeen to get to the show. That just shows the range of situations that we have.

We could of course have a Scalefour Far North, or a Scalefour Scotland but someone would have to organise it and it would have to cover the costs. Any member can make a proposal to the committee if they want this to happen.

Trevor Grout wrote:if stoke mandaville has a high speed broadband connection available, perhaps a few stratigic wireless webcams might be setup, for those who cannot realistically get there to soak up the show from afar.


Sounds like a good idea to me. Any offers to do it?

davidb wrote: I hope the proportion of the membership that does make it to the show will be greater than ever.


Hear hear! That would be the best thing to come out of the move. We have the attendance figures for the last 20 years and each year about one third of the membership comes. It would be really great if the preportion of members coming increased.

Terry Bendall

billbedford

Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby billbedford » Wed May 15, 2013 9:34 am

Natalie Graham wrote:I need ScaleFar North :)


……..go on then:-)

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dcockling
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby dcockling » Wed May 15, 2013 10:09 am

Natalie Graham wrote:More local maybe but not more central. I suppose the question is whether it is better to have a location which is in the area with the biggest membership, or one which is within reasonable traveling distance for the maximum number of people. I don't expect the society to hold Scaleforum in, say, Aberdeen just for my benefit but if those of us for whom it is not a practical distance to travel don't say anything then the society won't know if there are sufficient numbers of us to mean that it is something to be looked at.


Ah but what constitutes 'reasonable'? I once received a non-renewal from someone who left because we didn't organise any shows near to where he lived: Birmingham! Sometimes distance doesn't equate to ease of, or time taken in getting somewhere:

http://bigthink.com/strange-maps/393-the-unevenness-of-space-time-convergence Or the man who when asked the way replied, "if I were you I wouldn't start from here"

Also for those that may not have seen or remember some of my previous posts regarding where members are: http://www.scalefour.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2278&start=100#p20519 and http://www.scalefour.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=1217#p8344

This map isn't up to date, having been done several years ago (March 2008 I think), but things won't be very much different today:

Members by Postcde Area.gif


All the Best
Danny
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Andy W
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Andy W » Wed May 15, 2013 11:17 am

What the map makes me realise is just how thin we are on the ground - even in the "denser" areas. It shows how lucky the average member like me is to have officials and other members that make the society such a positive experience.
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Natalie Graham

Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Natalie Graham » Wed May 15, 2013 12:04 pm

dcockling wrote:Ah but what constitutes 'reasonable'?


Personally I start to seriously question it when it takes longer to get to event than the event itself takes. Perhaps in the case of something Like Scaleforum the benchmark could be set as whether it is possible to get there and back the same day. Personally, if I could set off on Saturday morning attend the majority of the day, stay over, and then attend most of Sunday and be home again Sunday night I would think that within a realistic traveling distance.

I appreciate that what is reasonable is very much down to individuals. I think probably people in the more peripheral areas are more used to traveling further to things than those in more central places and I sometimes think that there are some who don't realise that the transport routes to London also go in the opposite direction. I recall many years ago that the 2mm Association had their AGM at Derby and people from the south east complained that it was too far away. The next year they held it at Euston station, in a room above the main concourse, (how much more accessible can you get?) and still the majority of those attending were from Yorkshire (I believe they hired a bus) and elsewhere in the north. On the other hand the 3mm Society at one time had scarcely any members in the North of England or Scotland. For them it would have been pointless to organise society events in those areas. They did have a lot of members in the South West though and one of their best attended events was held in Salisbury. So it is very much a matter of judgement as to where those who are motivated enough to attend events will come from or too.

Terry makes the comment that 'we have to be practical and choose a venue that will be accessible to the majority'. While I agree with this I would say that maybe the criteria might be that 'will be accessible to as many as possible'. Having the event in the middle of the area with the most members does not necessarily maximise accessibility. Looking at Danny's map you could site the event in that little blue bit near the Welsh border where it would appear that there is very little interest but it would be reasonably central to all the orange and red areas around it

I do want to stress that I am not complaining or arguing with the choice of venue. and I most certainly do not want to be seen as unappreciative of what must be an amazing amount of work involved in putting the event together. Personally I am disappointed it is not closer to where I live but I appreciate it has to be sited where it will get people through the doors and not least somewhere convenient for those who are organising it. But as I said earlier if those of us who would like to attend but are too far away don't wave and say 'Hey, we're over here' then the next time the Society considers the venue for Scaleforum no-one will know if there is interest for a venue further north and it will look like we aren't interested.

As to my none too serious comment about Scalefar North. I doubt very much that an event up here would work. The excellent finescale show at New Lanark bit the dust some years ago after quite a short life. Generally, modelling in these parts seems to be more of the 'take it out of the box and watch it run round and round' persuasion. Look at the response to another member's attempt to get Perth Show to have a P4 layout.

Armchair Modeller

Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Armchair Modeller » Wed May 15, 2013 12:26 pm

Looking at that map, Aylesbury seems as central as you could reasonably get for the vast majority of the membership. If only Dr Beeching had not closed most of the local railways :o

Jo Palmer

Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Jo Palmer » Wed May 15, 2013 2:27 pm

When it comes to the location of society events something that does need to be considered is how convenient it is for the organiser(s) of the event. Bear in mind that sorting out a show involves a reasonable amount of co-ordination with the venue itself and it is hardly practical or fair to expect the organiser to travel huge distances to do that on a regular basis.

As someone who was involved in the running of Scaleforum in various roles over the years, it was certainly a lot easier when I lived in the South East, than it was when I moved to the South West. And of course the rest of the team was based far closer to Leatherhead. And the move from Leatherhead to Aylesbury has the advantage that it is closer to where Terry lives, which seems perfectly reasonable to me. Obviously that was far from the only reason to change the venue, but it must have been one consideration.

Aylesbury is a known venue because of Railex and clearly is central enough for that event to get a good number of visitors. I will certainly be making the journey up from Devon to visit Scaleforum this year and in future years.

As for being completely central - I was involved in helping with another non-railway event that was based in Stratford because it was deemed to be as central as you could get - and all that happened was that EVERYONE seemed to moan about how far they had to travel and those living and working closest to the venue didn't bother coming at all, so you really can't win!

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Horsetan
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Horsetan » Wed May 15, 2013 3:53 pm

Trevor Grout wrote:Just a thought

if stoke mandaville has a high speed broadband connection available, perhaps a few stratigic wireless webcams might be setup, for those who cannot realistically get there to soak up the show from afar.


Y e e e s s s . . . as long as the broadcast / webcast doesn't get hacked into by a bunch of fundamentalists!
That would be an ecumenical matter.

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MarkS
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby MarkS » Wed May 15, 2013 6:29 pm

Y e e e s s s . . . as long as the broadcast / webcast doesn't get hacked into by a bunch of fundamentalists!


No worries - "We have met the fundamentalists... and he is us" (with apologies to Pogo...)
Cheers,

Mark.
"In the end, when all is said and done, more will have been said than done..."

Philip Hall
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Philip Hall » Wed May 15, 2013 7:39 pm

As has been said, everyone's view on what constitutes a reasonable travelling distance is different, along with what time in the morning you have to get up to start the journey! I try to get to Scalefour North whenever possible, but I live in Surrey. So last April I had to get the very first train (0623!) in the morning to be up at Kings Cross in good time for the 8am departure to Wakefield. Peter Swift came from from even further south to join me at Waterloo, so he had an early start as well. We got to the show not long after it had opened, left at closing time and were home at 9pm.

So it is possible, if you want to do it, and in our case it was practical and comfortable as there were few changes before East Coast looked after us for a couple of hours. We might have felt differently had there been more changes and a longer journey time. In contrast, Scaleforum at Aylesbury, is much closer - maybe a one hour drive - but much more inconvenient for me to get to by train!

Philip

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grovenor-2685
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby grovenor-2685 » Wed May 15, 2013 11:24 pm

but much more inconvenient for me to get to by train!


OK, Surrey - Waterloo - Leicester square -KX - Wakefield (3 changes)
or, Surrey - Waterloo - Marylebone - Aylesbury (2 changes)

why is the second much more inconvenient?
Best
Keith
Not all that different for me, Woodford - Oxford Circus - Marylebone - Aylesbury, still 2 changes.
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Keith
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Philip Hall
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Philip Hall » Thu May 16, 2013 8:01 am

Keith, I take your point about the changes, but for me it's mostly the time. I can drive to Aylesbury in just under the hour. I looked up the journey using the SW Trains website just now and the shortest time is 2 3/4! It's also about the same price if you have a senior railcard (which I do) but more expensive than the fuel cost if you don't.

Sometimes the car wins, sometimes the train...

Philip

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grovenor-2685
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby grovenor-2685 » Thu May 16, 2013 8:39 am

OK Philip, understood, I thought you were comparing Aylesbury with Wakefield rather than car with train.
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Keith
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John Lewis
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby John Lewis » Tue Jun 04, 2013 9:33 pm

Is there going to be a bus service from Aylesbury station to the Exhibition venue, please?


John

Terry Bendall
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Terry Bendall » Wed Jun 05, 2013 5:57 am

John Lewis wrote:Is there going to be a bus service from Aylesbury station to the Exhibition venue, please?


Yes there will be a bus. It won't be a vintage bus since none are available, but it will be a bus or coach which will be operated by a local coach hire company - the exact vehicle is still to be discussed with the company. The timetable will be arranged to coincide with train arrivals at Aylesbury station.

Because we are hiring a bus there will be a charge to the Scaleforum budget. However we have decided that there won't be a fare changed to users but anyone who uses it and who wants to make a donation to the cost when they buy their entry ticket will be welcome to do so.

Further details of travel will be in the next issue of Scalefour News and will be posted on the Society web site in due course.

Terry Bendall

John Lewis
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby John Lewis » Thu Jun 06, 2013 6:55 pm

Terry

Thank you.

John

NorthHighlander
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby NorthHighlander » Fri Jun 07, 2013 8:14 pm

Now, folks, you COULD always have a Far North Scaleforum, after all we are on the same island and ONLY 720 miles from London....
All joking apart there are several organisations, glass makers, artists, musicians, book writers, even modellers, who plan weeks up here (similar to Hobby Holidays, I guess) and 'gain inspiration from the magic of the environment'. AND I have a vintage bus to collect people from Wick or Thurso, which is only a 4 hour train ride NORTH of Inverness!
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(ok, if you won't come up here, we'll come down there... see you at Stoke Mandeville...!

Natalie Graham

Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Natalie Graham » Sat Jun 08, 2013 10:41 am

NorthHighlander wrote:I have a vintage bus to collect people from Wick or Thurso,


(ok, if you won't come up here, we'll come down there... see you at Stoke Mandeville...!


Ooh, a vintage bus service running service from Thurso to Scaleforum in Aylesbury. What time do you pick up in Aberdeenshire? ;)

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Noel
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Noel » Sat Jun 08, 2013 2:47 pm

I would first check how vintage the bus is, Natalie. Most half-cab buses have a cruising speed under 50mph, less uphill...

Noel
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Tim V
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Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Tim V » Sat Jun 08, 2013 2:53 pm

So OK coming South, but slower on the return journey...
Tim V
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jayell

Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby jayell » Tue Jun 11, 2013 11:45 am

As a brand new member I haven't attended model railway exhibitions of any kind that I can remember. Scaleforum 2013 might be the "best" but Aylesbury isn't particularly easy to get to from Yeovil by road or rail, however Wells is just 3/4 hour up the road so my first ever (probably) exhibition will be RailWells 2013 in August. I am not all that interested in watching working layouts but there will be lots of trade stands and with luck I may even be able to spend some money there if I don't spend more than SWMBO likes in the meantime.

Natalie Graham

Re: Scaleforum 2013

Postby Natalie Graham » Tue Jun 11, 2013 12:10 pm

johnlewis wrote:As a brand new member I haven't attended model railway exhibitions of any kind that I can remember.[...] I am not all that interested in watching working layouts


You might surprise yourself when you get there. I can't say watching the workings of a layout is my main motivation either but it isn't just watching the trains go around but seeing the way the layouts are put together and the quality of the work involved. The ideas and inspiration are the biggest bonus from visiting exhibitions and seeing other people's work.


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