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DC 2 unfitted wagon brake gear.

Posted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 11:20 am
by Craig Warton
The release of the Parkside Dundas O13 China Clay wagon has destroyed my reason to procrastinate about a GWR era clay branch and so I have duly purchased a few and started assembly. After building up the body and cobbling most of the DC2 brakegear from masokits and Bill Bedford parts I really cannot get my head around what happens between the cross shaft and the brake levers. The photo of O13 92971 is from the door end and a bit unclear. Was the actuation basically the same as an unfitted DC3 wagon or different - and if so ...how? I assume the quadrant is on the other side, as I think I can make that out.

Can anyone clear me up please? I know the logical thing to do is go to Didcot and look at things, but the trivial detail of living in Australia does rule that out. On the bright side though, we are heading towards summer :D

regards,

Craig Warton

Re: DC 2 unfitted wagon brake gear.

Posted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 8:01 pm
by Penrhos1920
Craig,

Have a look at http://www.gwr.org.uk/nowagonbrakes.html It describes DC II but it's the only variant without a drawing. But if you use the LHS of the DC III drawing together with the description you should get the idea.

Re: DC 2 unfitted wagon brake gear.

Posted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 10:45 pm
by grovenor-2685
Another source of some diagrams is Model Railway Constructor for July 1976 if you have access to anyone with a collection.
Regards
Keith

Re: DC 2 unfitted wagon brake gear.

Posted: Tue Jan 04, 2011 11:55 pm
by Craig Warton
DSC_0004a.jpg
The attached image shows what i am currently up to with the 013 kit. Bill Bedford W-irons, Ultrascale wheels and brake gear that is a mixture of BB and Masokits bits. The tie rods are 0.45mm dia rod from Eileens. Buffers will be ABS bases drilled out to take MJT rams.

Still procrastinating about fitting AJ's to it. I built all the palatine Models jigs and built some test AJs from them.

The solebars need to be thinned a fair bit to fit the BB units, but that aside it is a really nice kit.

Re: DC 2 unfitted wagon brake gear.

Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 10:32 am
by JackBlack
I have MRC July 76, I'll try and scan the page later.

I also have photos of the O11 and O13 wagons at Didcot. The O13 has normal RCH type brakes, but the O11 has unfitted DC3 type:

sDSCF0305.jpg
sDSCF0305.jpg (98.87 KiB) Viewed 5392 times


I have a load of photos of this wagon with all the brake gear detail which I can zip and email to you if that helps. Cheers, Nick

Re: DC 2 unfitted wagon brake gear.

Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 3:53 pm
by iak
Craig Warton wrote:
DSC_0004a.jpg
The attached image shows what i am currently up to with the 013 kit. Bill Bedford W-irons, Ultrascale wheels and brake gear that is a mixture of BB and Masokits bits. The tie rods are 0.45mm dia rod from Eileens. Buffers will be ABS bases drilled out to take MJT rams.

Still procrastinating about fitting AJ's to it. I built all the palatine Models jigs and built some test AJs from them.

The solebars need to be thinned a fair bit to fit the BB units, but that aside it is a really nice kit.


Now that is a nice bit of work mon...
Which bits of whose brake gear is which please?

Re: DC 2 unfitted wagon brake gear.

Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:53 pm
by Craig Warton
Hi Nick,

Your offer of photographs is most gratefully accepted - Didcot (or anywhere in the UK) is not somewhere I can go to take those useful detail pics. I did suspect that the 013 would have gone through the brakes both sides routine, but at least it is an 013!

Ian, most of the brake gear is the Bill Bedford DC3, modified to be as close to DC2 as I can get it. The BB etchings seem to have a bit of a cusp on them that needs cleaning up and the DC lever did not fold up quite right so I had to file that a little bit. I *think* that the actual lever frame itself is from a Masokits etch but which ever type you use it needs to be cut around quite severely. The W-irons (1907 RCH) sit fairly close to the end of the wagon so you need to file the lever frame to fit in place.

Self contained buffers are proving to be a bugger. The only steel heads I could find are the MJT ones. These are 12" head with a 2.45mm dia ram. The ABS base had the head cut off and was then mounted in a collet on my unimat to drill out. But 2.45 mm is really, really pushing it on the castings! John Hayes mentioned in his MRJ article on GWR vans (#113 & 114) that he used MJT heads with a 2.1mm ram, but they are not listed now. I managed to do one last night and killed one casting. Not sure I like the attrition rate to do this so the next lot of wagons may have non sprung buffers. I now have the axle boxes fitted (ABS) and only the buffers, door bang springs and a bit of detailing to go. Then I will do the other 4!

regards,

Craig Warton

Re: DC 2 unfitted wagon brake gear.

Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 10:23 pm
by craig_whilding
Probably better off buying normal size rams (0.9mm/1mm) with the 12" head and sleeving them out to something like 2mm with brass tube, hopefully Eileens or someone does 1mm ID 2mm OD tube you could use for this. I've not needed to do self contained buffers yet but this was the approach I was going to attempt after I saw someone do it with plastic tube. I find sprung buffers make a big different to propelling moves but aren't essential for a roundy round train.

Could the detail shots go onto the scalefour website somewhere or perhaps a thread on here. Proper etches for the DC brake gear are on my list to do as I have an 013 to do as well as some of the longer vans that had them.

The GWR brake shoes are closer to the Masokits ones on the component part brake frets incidentally (though I think they are a two ended 1907 type really) rather than Bill's RCH1923 shoe which is the brakes I think you used.

Re: DC 2 unfitted wagon brake gear.

Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 11:48 pm
by Craig Warton
Craig,

Your suggestion for the buffer rams is the rather obvious one and I will order some tube from Eileens tonight. Should be here by the time I get back from camping.

I agree about the brake shoes, I cant help but think that the BB DC3 brake gear may have used some bits of the 1923 RCH for inspiration on the drawing board. Masokits only do DC1 and cross cornered DC1 and I would consume too much of my stash of their parts using them to want to go that way. hence my using the BB bits. having said that, the bottom push rods should be close to parallel with the solebar and they are not. It bugs me no end, but instead of putting it aside I am going to finish it..... I have way too many half built things around! However, if you are feeling inclined to do some "proper DC2 brake gear for an 013 you can count me in. I am looking at doing a shunting plank based loosely on Moorswater in the early 1920s so i want about 20 or so of these in the end. That also suggests that sprung buffers are the go.

I second the idea of an on line repository for detail pictures, would be a good thing for the society web site....

regards,

Craig Warton

Re: DC 2 unfitted wagon brake gear.

Posted: Wed Jan 05, 2011 11:53 pm
by grovenor-2685
I second the idea of an on line repository for detail pictures, would be a good thing for the society web site....

well this is the society website, so just start a topic.
Regards
Keith

Re: DC 2 unfitted wagon brake gear.

Posted: Thu Jan 06, 2011 11:25 pm
by seanmcs
Craig:

I should have mentioned this the other day. I am contemplating PD GWR 10 ton opens 011 that have GWR buffers with those cast in dart reinforcements. I am in correspondence with Colin Seymour (delayed on my part) and am due to email him some pix based on which he will try to match it up, in a sprung version.

Sean

Re: DC 2 unfitted wagon brake gear.

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 9:58 am
by JackBlack
Craig, I've sent you an email with a link to zip files of these photos. If anyone else wants them please let me know.

seanmcs wrote:I should have mentioned this the other day. I am contemplating PD GWR 10 ton opens 011 that have GWR buffers with those cast in dart reinforcements. I am in correspondence with Colin Seymour (delayed on my part) and am due to email him some pix based on which he will try to match it up, in a sprung version.


If I'm reading this right and someone is producing a sprung version of a GWR self-contained buffer then that's great news.

Cheers, Nick

Re: DC 2 unfitted wagon brake gear.

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:17 pm
by Penrhos1920
JackBlack wrote:
If I'm reading this right and someone is producing a sprung version of a GWR self-contained buffer then that's great news.

Cheers, Nick


This is how I have done them in the past: http://www.penrhos.me.uk/Inprogress.htm At one point about 5 years ago I had 10 wagons on the go which all received sprung buffers made this way.