Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Dave Holt
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Dave Holt » Sat Sep 04, 2021 1:07 pm

I'm not sure this should be in this section of the Forum but I can't see anywhere more appropriate, so here goes.

Not much progress recently, due partly to being on holiday and partly because being hunched over my work bench does not help with my back problems, although I'm pleased to say that appears to be diminishing day-by-day.
Anyway, I decided to send 46109 on its holidays and posed it on a section of my embryonic layout, Holt, out in the garden.
Here we see the loco after arrival with a returning Wakes Week holiday excursion - possibly from Scarborough, routed via Stalybridge, Guide Bridge, Ashton and Oldham; the loco being attached at Leeds.
Holt_trains_002.JPG

Holt_trains_003.JPG

Holt_trains_004.JPG

After the Scot had pushed back, run round its train and departed, empty stock, one of the regular push-pull trains arrived behind BR Standard Class 2 tank, 84012. The train is made up of a converted LMS Period II open third and an ex-LNWR driving trailer to diagram M15.
Holt_trains_006.JPG

Holt_trains_007.JPG

Holt_trains_008.JPG

All the coaches (except the LMS Period II - built by me and painted by Larry) seen were built and painted by Larry Goddard, the station platform, building and goods shed were made by Peter Leyland. The locos by me (84012 painted, lined and weathered by David Clarke).

Dave.
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Julian Roberts
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Julian Roberts » Tue Sep 07, 2021 2:51 pm

Looks superb Dave. I didn't notice the lack of backscene, with the natural vegetation behind. Does Larry Goddard still build coaches? Nothing comes up on a Google search. Did you say elsewhere the pointwork is made by Tony Wilkins? Holt...so it's not a model of a particular location I suppose?

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barrowroad
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby barrowroad » Tue Sep 07, 2021 4:41 pm

Your Scot looks great Dave as does your layout - nice photos.

Robin

Dave Holt
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Dave Holt » Tue Sep 07, 2021 4:50 pm

Julian,
Thanks for the kind comments.
As you say, there is no back scene - just the garden trees. The intention is to have some cantilevered, light weight scenic boards behind the main structural boards. These will carry some houses, a mill and rising landscape nearer the fiddle yard end of the layout. As regards a pictorial back scene, due to problems of perspective and half modelled buildings, my idea was just to have a completely plain back drop and leave it to the viewers imagination.
As far as I know, Larry no longer makes coaches on commission, although he still builds coaches and posts about them on Western Thunder. It might be worth contacting him through that site?
Despite the name (not sure where I dreamed that up from) the station area is a near scale model of Delph, as it was in about 1954. However, I originally intended to replace the rather gloomy looking mill which loomed over the back of the platform with a lovely red brick Edwardian era cotton mill (same architect as the MMRS Alfa Mill). With such a change, I felt I could not call the layout "Delph", hence the Holt name.
Dave.

Dave Holt
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Dave Holt » Mon Sep 13, 2021 11:17 am

This morning, I spotted a mistake in the routeing of the train vacuum pipe below the cab. The marvellous Wild Swan profile book does not include the end views on the pipe & rod drawing, so I had made an assumption based on other late LMS locos and run the vertical leg of the pipe just inboard of the footplate valence - a very prominent position, as seen below.
Original arrangement:
Scot_221.JPG

However, I realised that, on Scots, this pipe is not as prominent in photos and actually runs inboard of the injector delivery pipe. In fact, the correct location for the pipe is just about indicated on the external end view drawing, now that I've looked more carefully. A modified version of the pipe was bent up from 0.8 mm brass wire and used to replace part of the original, as seen below.
Revised pipe arrangement:
Scot_222.JPG

Still putting off the smoke deflectors!
Dave.
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Dave Holt
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Dave Holt » Mon Jan 03, 2022 9:06 pm

Gosh. Nothing posted since last September. That's because there's been no actual modelling since then, although I have been planning some future loco projects and a couple of buildings for the layout.
Anyway, I've had a fit of enthusiasm to finish off the Scot and have done some work on the smoke deflectors. These have been bent to profile and temporarily fixed to the loco. They attach using two 16 BA screws through the footplate and clips over the hand rails. The current state is as shown below.
Scot_223.JPG

Scot_224.JPG

Still to do are the covers behind the hand holes, cosmetic bracing struts from the front edge to the smokebox and the beading. The kit provides a flat etch for this latter but I'm hoping to use half-round section, made by filing down 0.4 mm brass wire.
Wish me luck!
Dave.
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Steve4RoseGrove
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Steve4RoseGrove » Mon Jan 03, 2022 10:45 pm

Hello and Happy New Year Dave - I keep checking to see if I've missed a post.
Nice work (as always) and an inspiration to get back to my Brassmasters Black 5.
I ground to a halt on the chassis when I ruined a driving wheel trying to remove a sheared crankpin, then stopped on the body when I couldn't get the cab footplate on straight. New drivers acquired so that should be OK (I hope the crankpin throws is exactly the same as the 0-6-0 chassis ran perfectly first time) and after a long break (don't ask) perhaps that footplate will go on straight and reach the main footplate.
Cheers,
Steve

Dave Holt
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Dave Holt » Tue Jan 04, 2022 1:54 pm

Thanks, Steve.
I hope your Black 5 works out OK. As you say, crank throw is quite critical at smooth running. On the Scot, I've used two different types of Gibson wheel but which both had the same specified throw, without any problems. You don't say the make of your wheels, but I recall the Gibsons I used did not have crankpin holes and had to be drilled - obviously, I did all mine at one set-up to ensure consistency. That might be an issue if your wheels are the same as you're trying to exactly match the existing wheels. If they're Ultrascale, I don't think you'll have any problem.

The deflectors do make quite a difference to the look of the loco, in my opinion. Here it is in its present state.
Scot_225.JPG

Dave.
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Steve4RoseGrove
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Steve4RoseGrove » Tue Jan 04, 2022 9:06 pm

Hi Dave,

Looking good with those distinctive deflectors.
Original 6 wheels the lovely Studiolith Mk1 with the tapered fit. New centre wheels Gibson. I have some Studiolith Mk2 wheels but they are NiSi treads which I and not keen on for looks or traction. I think that I'll try the Gibsons first and see how it goes with fingers crossed.

Philip Hall
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Philip Hall » Wed Jan 05, 2022 12:34 am

Mick Moore wrote an article in an MRJ years ago about building two engines of the same class, one fitted with steel tyred wheels and the other nickel silver. The nickel wheels (Ultrascale) had a finer surface finish, and traction was actually better than the steel! Granted the appearance of steel is better.

Philip

Steve4RoseGrove
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Steve4RoseGrove » Wed Jan 05, 2022 3:01 am

Thanks Philip, that's interesting. That suggests that at a micro (micron?) level the greater surface area in contact has a noticeable positive effect on the frictional forces. As I believe that similar materials have the highest coefficient of friction (part of the reason for preferring steel tyres) then perhaps the best for me would be Gibsons with highly polished treads.
Steve

Philip Hall
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Philip Hall » Wed Jan 05, 2022 10:45 am

I have heard an opinion that steel wheels are best on steel rails, and nickel silver wheels on nickel silver rail, but that was to do with electrical cleanliness. I am using nickel silver rail (not hi-ni) and so far have not had any problems with either kind of wheels. I think the friction element would only be of great consequence if you are intending great heavy loads. I might be, on just a couple of trains (2kg roughly) so I shall find out one day!

Philip

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Julian Roberts
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Julian Roberts » Thu Jan 06, 2022 9:56 am

Looking forward to the finished article Dave! It's looking fabulous of course already. I didn't know smoke deflectors were such a pain, assuming that's partly why you've been putting them off since September...

Dave Holt
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Dave Holt » Thu Jan 06, 2022 12:41 pm

Thanks, Julian.
You're right, they aren't such a big deal really, just in my head! These deflectors are a bit more complicated than most due to the shape, separate beading and being removable but still, compared with crank axles and inside valvegear, they should be a doddle. However, as you rightly suspect, I let the perceived difficulties lead to putting them off for a few months.
Dave.

Dave Holt
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Dave Holt » Fri Jan 07, 2022 11:48 am

Well, smoke deflectors completed and fitted. Apart from AJ couplings, buffer heads, name and number plates and cab glazing, all to be done after painting, I think that completes construction of the Scot.
Here are two not very good photos showing the finished deflectors in situ.
Scot_226.JPG

Scot_227.JPG

Dave.
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triumph3
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby triumph3 » Fri Jan 07, 2022 6:03 pm

Dave, looking really good.
The paintshop is ready and waiting!

Are you going to finish of the Black 5 next?

David

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Julian Roberts
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Julian Roberts » Sat Jan 08, 2022 8:43 am

Bravo Dave, the beading looks super. Inspirational work, thank you for posting this thread and the one on the Black 5. I wonder why we find it so easy to start things, and even when it's going as well as this one has been, find it difficult to finish them?

Anyway - what's next? :D

Dave Holt
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Re: Brassmasters Rebuilt Royal Scot, 46109

Postby Dave Holt » Sat Jan 08, 2022 11:51 am

Thanks for the comments.
I agree, finishing things is always a bit of a struggle. The next step for the Scot is to completely disassemble it, de-grease and wash ready for painting. I will paint the chassis but leave the body painting, lining and weathering to Davis Clarke, who is far more skilled at this than I ever will be.
I must say, I find this part of the build particularly hard to get down to as it seems such a retrograde step after the model is all complete. My previous build, the Black 5, has been stripped down for ages and still I haven't started the chassis painting. Some day.........
Anyway, here's a last look at the completed Scot, coupled to its tender, prior to disassembly.
Scot_228.JPG

Suppose I ought to finish to the Ivatt Class 2 tank next rather than starting anything completely new?
Dave.
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