SR 0-6-0 E2's - Latest build complete with Video Operation

[Andy W]

"So I just tested for shirts...." should have read shorts (of the electrical sort) - just in case anyone thinks I'm getting sartorial or that I've started to believe that the wrong type of upper garment can affect the running of a chassis.

[Knuckles]

I (and I think most people here) would echo Ealing's recommendation of High Level gearboxes. There's a very useful gearbox planner on High Level's website which enables you to print out profiles of all the High Level gearboxes. You can then cut them out and see which one will suit. I'd have thought that a RoadRunner+, or possibly a RoadRunner+ with Drive Stretcher, would suit you. You'll also find that Chris Gibbon of High level is extremely helpful if you give him a ring.

DT

A small but important point to mention is that any of the + ("plus") marked gearboxes have a swinging final drive, mounted in a cradle.

This is enormously useful in getting an effective and concealed fitting. For a very small cost more - a quid over the fixed versions I think - it is many, many times more valuable.

HTH
Flymo

Yeah after looking at the sheet I think that might be the one I need, seems almost the same as what I have now. 3rd time lucky?

[Armchair Modeller]

The grub does not seem to have burrowed into the same place on all the Comet gearboxes.

I have a simpler one-stager which has the conventional grub screw position to one side of the gear.

[Jol Wilkinson]

The gears shown in Knuckle's posting of 25 Jan look very much like the ones Markits supply. They have the grubscrew in a boss at one end of the worm so it could well be a manufacturing c*ck up. Comet should supply replacements as these don't sound fit for purpose.

Knuckle's, if you have no luck, measure the worm diameter and threads per inch/centimeter. I may have a non grubscrew version in the bits box to get you out of trouble.

Jol

[Knuckles]

Thanks Jol, that's most kind of you. The worm itself is fine, the issue is with the first cog touching the worm.

Ignoring the teeth the diameter is 5mm's, with the teeth 6mm's, width 3mm's, 2mm shaft, and 22 teeth.

With this design there is no where but the teeth to put a grub but the fact you have washers either side suggests they could have done it there, or not bothered with a grub at all. Fixing the shaft with glue or Loctite works fine.



I got an email back but no luck sadly. Apparently a few others have had similar issues yet others are fine.


Edit: just thought, I still need balance weights. I've tried making my own, and although I know I can the other day I gave up because it seems trial and error. So...any suggestions on ones that can be brought? I have searched but found nothing suitable yet.

[David Thorpe]

I got an email back but no luck sadly. Apparently a few others have had similar issues yet others are fine.

I don't understand that. If some have had issues (by which I assume he means faults) and yours is one of them, you're entitled to a replacement (Sale of Goods Act - goods should be fit for purpose). Did you buy the gearbox from Comet or from a retailer?

Markits have a range of balance wheels, but they tend to be for specific locos.

DT.

[Knuckles]

I brought them from Mainlytrains.com.

In the email I was told they do replacements but not of a different design (I.E still with a hole.in the teeth.)
I can reproduce the emails here but unsure if that would not be the done thing.

[Paul Willis]

I brought them from Mainlytrains.com.

In the email I was told they do replacements but not of a different design (I.E still with a hole.in the teeth.)
I can reproduce the emails here but unsure if that would not be the done thing.

Best not.

Simply put, I don't think that a bit of dirty washing would do anything to make your model run any better.

I have a load of old cogs and worms that I've salvaged from various sources and put away for "a rainy day". I'll have a mooch through them and see if I can find something that matches your description.

Flymo

[allanferguson]

I'm sorry to be a bit late picking up on this, and I may be being a bit naive. If the problem gearbox is the one illustrated, then surely there is no need to secure the gears to their shafts, except for the final drive C. A and B are idler gears which simply transmit the drive. Looking at it the mesh between the worm and the initial gear A doesn't look good. I seem to remember having this problem once, and resolved it by enlarging the motor securing holes and moving the motor a bit. Another time I found it made a difference when I used the vertical holes for the motor mounting rather than the horizontal ones. But now I only buy High Level gearboxes......

Allan F

41624MashimaCompletewith1-50DriveExtenderandKnuxBodge.jpg

[Paul Willis]

I have a load of old cogs and worms that I've salvaged from various sources and put away for "a rainy day". I'll have a mooch through them and see if I can find something that matches your description.

Flymo

Ah... Found the bag...

IMG_6851.JPG

You're welcome to them if you want to have a play and see if anything fits. PM me your address and I'll stick them in the post...

Flymo

[Jol Wilkinson]

Hi Knuckles,

I too have got a bit confused and thought the problem was with the worm. Can you post a photo of the gearbox "end on" showing the offending bit and where the interference occurs.

Jol

Edit.

A bit of further research. I wondered if Comet commission their own gears or buy them in, so I looked at the Markits 2013 catalogue, Section 9A. That lists a gear that would seem to match yours but without the boss, ref. MGR-4-100-222Rnb. If Allan F is right and the gear doesn't need a grubscrew than this might do the job, with some washers to control the sideplay.

[David Thorpe]

It all seems to me very curious. Comet, a highly reputable company, have been producing this gearbox for years and if there was indeed an inherent fault I'm sure that Geoff would have ensured that it was remedied. Is there something we're all missing?

DT

[Knuckles]

Hi Flymo. I've had a really good look at your photograph zoomed in, counted teeth and everything but in truth I'm convinced non would be suitable. Big thanks for the offer though.

To DaveyTee; I'll prepare a new picture from a new packet from another gearbox because mine has 'kind of' been filled in. Will have to wait a while though.

To Jol, regarding your Markits suggestion. I've just had a look at I think it fits the description perfectly. I am unsure on what it means when it says R/H - Right hand though. I know when you look at the teeth head on the highest point is the left and the teeeth slope to the right, if that is the case then I'm guessing it's a match. Also the fact that NO BOSS is in bold suggests the film is trying to get a known point across!

Think a phone call might be in order.

The chassis was already taken apart but if I do manage to get the cog that fits then it would have been pointless. ...me....plonka.

Again, many thanks for your collective help.

[Mike Garwood]

I have a load of old cogs and worms that I've salvaged from various sources and put away for "a rainy day". I'll have a mooch through them and see if I can find something that matches your description.

Flymo

Ah... Found the bag...

Paul

You really didn't like the Sharman gearbox did you! What did you do with all the missing threads? Gavin, sorry to hi-jack this.

Mike

[Horsetan]

....I am unsure on what it means when it says R/H - Right hand though. I know when you look at the teeth head on the highest point is the left and the teeth slope to the right.....

That suggests a right-hand helix, perhaps? i.e. the gear teeth are not "straight-cut" (or at right angles to the circumference), but slanted.

[grovenor-2685]

All the info for this gearset is in the Comet pdf instructions for the 50:1 drive extender which can be found on Comet's site. Its rather odd that this gear quite clearly does not need any grubscrew and does not seem to be used in any other gearbox of theirs, so why supply it with a grubscrew and then tell users to leave it loose? So the suspicion must be that Comet's suppliers fit the grubscrew for other customers and don't want to do a special.Whatever, drilling through the teeth to fit a grubscrew is a somewhat odd idea, not what I would call good practice.
Looking at the Markits catalogue the gears do seem to match and while the 22t R/H helix gear states, 'no boss' its silent on the grubscrew question and the illustrations don't help.
Keith

[Knuckles]

To the latest posts, indeed, indeed and indeed! I'll give Markits a phone call later in the new week and probe them. The email I got from Comet made it pretty clear they didn't want to do another cog, but also showed some honesty by admitting others have had a similar problem. It was also suggested I wasn't building it right and that could be the issue but I disagree.

-

I think after I'm going to buy a Hornby body and have another go with that. Truth is I think this old kit body is pretty horrid.
I naively thought at the time of planning, simply being a 'kit' the model would be far superior as a base to detail over the old Hornby plastic one but after having a good look I think I was wrong.


I don't know what is the most accurate in terms of basic dimentions so last night I measured my metal body to that of my Hornby Thomas, which is basically an E2 with a few tweaks and it seems the Hornby one is 2mm's shorter and about 2mm's fatter. I don't know which is more accurate but to be honest Im unsure if It matters that much. Both models seem to have pro's and con's.
Hornby's running plate is thicker and to my eye more correct when compared to prototype, yet the metal ones are too thin, conversely the running plate curves at each end I think are more flowingly accurate on the metal one but hard to build neat, whereas the Hornby one has them too tall and sharp an angle. The metal one has a better detailed and shaped smokebox saddle plus rivet detail on the tanks, but the Hornby has the 'lip' around the tank tops and bunker, an open cab, plus a thinner more realistic roof and bunker lamp irons etc.

So taken together it seems each option has things going for it and things against it.
I'd like your thoughts on this as I'm seriously thinking of just tweaking a Hornby E2 slightly. Nothing fancy, just tank extensions and a couple of details.
About 30 minutes ago I decided to cut out the doors and re-do them. The first was easy enough, the second however split the cab roof off, broke part of the ill fitting running plate and generally buggered everything up, so much so that I couldn't seem to get it back and in line very easily. These two pictures tell the story...




Many appologies to those who may have been disapointed or even offended at this, but it had to be done I'm afraid. It just isn't worth any more of my time and effort for a base model that clearely doesn't want to co-operate, and is so disapointingly thick, ill fitting and crude to begin with that amongst literally hours of (what should be unnessasary) remedial work, will ultimately require a wealth of extra detailing work that the Hornby one already has. Sorry.

I'm not angry, but relieved, I actually found it rather funny. I haven't gave up on the chassis.

Right, mr Ebay, where are you.....


Plastic looks sharper and thinner, white metal I've lost faith with as a base. It's just too bloody crude.

[Horsetan]

You could always send the remains back to Dave Ellis at SEF, so he can then melt it all down and reuse the molten metal for something a bit more modern.....

Just a thought.

[Knuckles]

Nah, I wouldn't want to offend him. The kit I think is 40, 50 or 60 years old so...

Nah, I'll just take it as experience and move on.

Oh just thought. I did buy two didn't I?

I have a whitemetal LBSCR E2 kit, still in it's box and everything if ye are interested, discount price too.



Future posts here will be on the chassis or Hornby body modifications - hardly riveting, or super quality modelling but never mind.

[David Thorpe]

So that's what kit bashing is!

There have been several occasions when i would very much like to have done what you've just done, Knuckles, but I've never yet been able to bring myself to do it. As a result I have several absolutely hopeless old whitemetal kits that I know I'll never finish (and wouldn't want to anyway) just taking up space. Perhaps now's the time!

DT

[Knuckles]

You know, the Kit Bashing phrase never crossed my mind!



EDIT: Tony Wright in Right Track DVD 1 said that the whitemetal chassis of old kits are good as ballast if you pound them, nothing more. He never mentioned the bodies.

What's wrong with your kits and which ones?

[Horsetan]

.... I have a whitemetal LBSCR E2 kit, still in it's box and everything if ye are interested, discount price too. .....

I think not

[Knuckles]

EDIT: Had a change of heart; thought I'd solder it back together.

[David Knight]

As I recall Bill Bedford recommended keeping a large hammer close to hand for just such occasions. You method seems to work quite well and you were able to salvage a few castings to boot!

Not to worry Knuckles, 'tis a rare bird who hasn't been where you are on this one.

Cheers,

David

[Knuckles]

LOL! He did indeed, but he was talking of one of his etches that I insulted by folding the lines te wrong way. Was still funny.