Fowler Motion Bracket support (reverser shaft support)

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Hardwicke
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Fowler Motion Bracket support (reverser shaft support)

Postby Hardwicke » Thu Mar 23, 2023 3:31 pm

Does anyone know if a Fowler 4P motion support bracket is available as a spare part? It seems the whole motion for Fowler and LMS locos is availabe with varying degrees of fidelity, but not as a seperate part.
I have a Hornby 4P 2-6-4T with a converted Comet? chassis, but the support bar across the frames was missed out and a bar subsititued. Needeless to say, it looks wrong and doesn't do the job correctly.

Thanks
Last edited by Hardwicke on Fri Jul 14, 2023 11:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
Ordsall Road (BR(E)), Forge Mill Sidings (BR(M)), Kirkcliffe Coking Plant (BR(E)), Swanage (BR (S)) and Heaby (LMS/MR). Acquired Thorneywood (GNR). Still trying to "Keep the Balance".

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Hardwicke
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Re: Fowler Motion Bracket support

Postby Hardwicke » Wed Apr 26, 2023 3:49 pm

New support bracket fretted out and trail fitted yesterday
Ordsall Road (BR(E)), Forge Mill Sidings (BR(M)), Kirkcliffe Coking Plant (BR(E)), Swanage (BR (S)) and Heaby (LMS/MR). Acquired Thorneywood (GNR). Still trying to "Keep the Balance".

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Hardwicke
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Re: Fowler Motion Bracket support

Postby Hardwicke » Sun Jul 09, 2023 7:35 pm

I had a look at 80080 yesterday on the assumption that the design was basically an updated Fowler... Probably not quite right but you get the general idea
DSC_2699.JPG

DSC_2702.JPG

DSC_2703.JPG

DSC_2704.JPG
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Last edited by Hardwicke on Fri Jul 14, 2023 11:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
Ordsall Road (BR(E)), Forge Mill Sidings (BR(M)), Kirkcliffe Coking Plant (BR(E)), Swanage (BR (S)) and Heaby (LMS/MR). Acquired Thorneywood (GNR). Still trying to "Keep the Balance".

Dave Holt
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Re: Fowler Motion Bracket support

Postby Dave Holt » Tue Jul 11, 2023 11:37 pm

Your photos focus mainly on the reverser shaft support bracket rather than the motion bracket (which supports the expansion link and rear end of the slide bars). Whilst this latter is quite similar on the Fowler locos to that shown on the Br Standard, the reverser shaft support was much more below the shaft on the Fowlers rather than in front and above, as in photos. The BR version was similar to the Stanier and Fairburn locos, rather than the Fowlers.
Dave.

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Hardwicke
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Re: Fowler Motion Bracket support

Postby Hardwicke » Fri Jul 14, 2023 10:47 am

Dave Holt wrote:Your photos focus mainly on the reverser shaft support bracket rather than the motion bracket (which supports the expansion link and rear end of the slide bars). Whilst this latter is quite similar on the Fowler locos to that shown on the Br Standard, the reverser shaft support was much more below the shaft on the Fowlers rather than in front and above, as in photos. The BR version was similar to the Stanier and Fairburn locos, rather than the Fowlers.
Dave.

Thanks Dave. I wasn't sure what it was called when I started the thread. In fact it wasn't on the model at all but the reversing lever bar "sort of" held it in place. I guess there should have been a part in the kit but it had never been fixed on by the builder. Watching 80080 change gear and seeing all the parts move made things clearer for me. I wanted to see the Patriot Group's reversing lever but it's in storage. I would have thought that would match the Fowler unless Stanier changed it later and the group followed on. I note they're going to build a 2300 if they complete the 4-6-0. Finding photos or plans of the reversing lever bracket is so difficult, but York NRM have plans listed. My girlfriend wants to go there; York, but not necessarily the research department of the museum.
Ordsall Road (BR(E)), Forge Mill Sidings (BR(M)), Kirkcliffe Coking Plant (BR(E)), Swanage (BR (S)) and Heaby (LMS/MR). Acquired Thorneywood (GNR). Still trying to "Keep the Balance".

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Hardwicke
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Re: Fowler Motion Bracket support (reverser shaft support)

Postby Hardwicke » Fri Jul 14, 2023 12:44 pm

I guess the NCC WT or 2-6-0 class might have the same brackets.
Ordsall Road (BR(E)), Forge Mill Sidings (BR(M)), Kirkcliffe Coking Plant (BR(E)), Swanage (BR (S)) and Heaby (LMS/MR). Acquired Thorneywood (GNR). Still trying to "Keep the Balance".

Dave Holt
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Re: Fowler Motion Bracket support (reverser shaft support)

Postby Dave Holt » Fri Jul 14, 2023 4:26 pm

As I said, the reverser shaft brackets on the Fowler tanks were quire different to the Stanier/Fairburn/BR Std design. The attached sketch, scaled from the LMS motion drawing, shows a slightly simplified arrangement for the Fowler type.
The dimensions for the stand outs from the back face of the brackets are based on scale frame width (17.25 mm outside) and would need to be adjusted for under scale width. Note that the underside of the "tray" and the triangular stiffening ribs just clear the coupling and connecting rods at top dead centre. Again these dimensions would need to be confirmed for the model crank throw and suspension travel.
Fowler_264T_reverser_shaft_brkt.JPG

The drawing in question is contained in the Wild Swan LMS Loco Profiles, No.3, which covers the Fowler tanks and is invaluable for modelling one of these locos.
Dave.
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Hardwicke
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Re: Fowler Motion Bracket support (reverser shaft support)

Postby Hardwicke » Fri Jul 14, 2023 7:18 pm

That's really useful Dave. Thanks.
I've just checked if I can get a copy of the said book. I can.
Ordsall Road (BR(E)), Forge Mill Sidings (BR(M)), Kirkcliffe Coking Plant (BR(E)), Swanage (BR (S)) and Heaby (LMS/MR). Acquired Thorneywood (GNR). Still trying to "Keep the Balance".

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Hardwicke
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Re: Fowler Motion Bracket support (reverser shaft support)

Postby Hardwicke » Sat Jul 22, 2023 4:09 pm

Dave Holt wrote:As I said, the reverser shaft brackets on the Fowler tanks were quire different to the Stanier/Fairburn/BR Std design. The attached sketch, scaled from the LMS motion drawing, shows a slightly simplified arrangement for the Fowler type.
Fowler_264T_reverser_shaft_brkt.JPG

Dave.

I've cut out a stretcher for these to be attached to, running through the frame; allowing a much stronger and accurate representation of the bracket. It took a lot of thinking and watching 80080 changing from forward to reverse gear for it all to make sense. I'll use wire for the side lips to the dish. At least it will hold the reversing lever rod in place.
Ordsall Road (BR(E)), Forge Mill Sidings (BR(M)), Kirkcliffe Coking Plant (BR(E)), Swanage (BR (S)) and Heaby (LMS/MR). Acquired Thorneywood (GNR). Still trying to "Keep the Balance".

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Hardwicke
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Re: Fowler Motion Bracket support (reverser shaft support)

Postby Hardwicke » Sat Jul 22, 2023 7:02 pm

Four brackets drilled to sit on the tray.
IMG20230722183149.jpg

Stretcher for the tray to sit on.
IMG20230722200258.jpg
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Ordsall Road (BR(E)), Forge Mill Sidings (BR(M)), Kirkcliffe Coking Plant (BR(E)), Swanage (BR (S)) and Heaby (LMS/MR). Acquired Thorneywood (GNR). Still trying to "Keep the Balance".


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