GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Inside the fence.
Tim Horn
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GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Tim Horn » Wed May 29, 2013 12:49 pm

GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

I've been developing this one after spending a few hours measuring it up a few months ago. Again, i've designed it on the laser cutter using 1mm MDF and hope to release some kits later on.

The capstones are produced on the 3d printer with the coping stones laser cut out of 2mm MDF with a little bit of sanding left to do. The bridge still needs to be finished and painted properly with the mortar course, but I think it's photographed quite nicely :thumb

Still got a few issues to sort out, but this one is nearing completion. I haven’t finished my GER E4 or J15, so I’ve had to use a class 47 for the photos ;)

Cheers
Tim

Bridge 2395 TJH01 Hockham Heath 2nd March 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Bridge 2395 test TJH02 14th May 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Bridge 2395 test TJH01 14th May 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Bridge 2395 test TJH03 14th May 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Bridge 2395 test TJH04 14th May 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Bridge 2395 test TJH05 14th May 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg

nigelcliffe
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby nigelcliffe » Wed May 29, 2013 4:05 pm

Very nice, I might want one when they are ready.

Your location says "mid Norfolk" - have you ever considered attending the "Norfolk and Suffolk Area Group" meetings ? The regular venue is not far from Diss at the Norfolk/Suffolk border, with other meetings wandering around both counties. Drop me an off-forum message for more details.

- Nigel

Tim Horn
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Tim Horn » Thu Jun 06, 2013 5:41 pm

Thanks Nigel, I may well do :)

Just keeping it Eastern related, I've also knocked up a small store type building, based on the end platform building at Dereham. This one is nearly complete and looks nice in the sun. Still some adjusting and painting to do.

Cheers
Tim

Small Office TJH01 Dereham 22nd September 2012 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Dereham Small Office test TJH04 30th May 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Dereham Small Office test TJH01 6th June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Dereham Small Office test TJH02 6th June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Dereham Small Office test TJH03 6th June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg

Tim Horn
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Tim Horn » Thu Jun 20, 2013 5:40 pm

Another project/kit in the pipeline is quite a nice little GER goods shed at Holme Hale, just a couple of villages down the road from my workshed. I photographed this one way back in 1987, just before it was converted into a house and have always wanted to make a model of it.

I've lasercut the artwork today to test the outer shell for interlocking bricks, all seems to work well. I've yet to pull apart my drawing to form up the various layers to give the brickwork a 3d appearance, and the laser cutter was playing up again today so if you look closely you can see that the laser became misaligned at some point during the cutting process. :cry:

Cheers
Tim

Holme Hale Goods shed TJH03 Summer 1987 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Holme Hale Goods shed TJH04 Summer 1987 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Holme Hale Goods shed TJH01 Summer 1987 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Holme Hale goods shed print test TJH01 20th June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Holme Hale goods shed print test TJH02 20th June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Holme Hale goods shed print test TJH03 20th June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Holme Hale goods shed print test TJH04 20th June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Holme Hale goods shed print test TJH05 20th June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg

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jim s-w
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby jim s-w » Fri Jun 21, 2013 7:58 am

Looks good Tim

I'd think about doing the slopey bits at the top of the pillars as a seperate bit and cut a hole in the main wall so that you can get the angle. The prototype roof is very thin indeed. Can you cut the roof to fit inside the walls or cut the top row of bricks into the end of the roof?

Just some idle thoughts but it's a lovely little prototype.

Cheers

Jim

Tim Horn
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Tim Horn » Fri Jun 21, 2013 2:30 pm

Hi Jim,

Nice idea for the slopey bits, was going to try and engrave them away, so to speak, but your idea may work better. The roof (just an off cut at the mo) should be lower when I've sorted out the internal roof trusses and such, I've not got a decent enough internal photo, so I'll have to look through some reading material to get a few ideas of how it might have been.

Thanks for the input, always welcome :)

Cheers
Tim

Holme Hale Goods shed TJH01 11th June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg

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martinm
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby martinm » Fri Jun 21, 2013 3:35 pm

Oh my!
That last photo shows a far more complex variance in levels of brickwork than I had imagined from the earlier shots.
You may have to resort to laying one course at a time on that apex. Can you cut single string courses?
That would then make it easier to fit trusses right up to the end, which is probably how it was, with the tiles laid to overhang on to the mortar bed on the end wall.
Each layer of the angled bricks at the top of the buttresses seems to be proud of the one below, so they probably also need laying in separate panels, angled as jim s-w suggests..
martin

DougN
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby DougN » Sat Jun 22, 2013 7:50 am

The brick work to the pediment seems to have been "decorative freezes" seem to in set by at least one course which we wound never see done today due to the cost and possibly the skill levels of the trades involved. The 3 courses seem to over lap by about an inch to each course thereby cribbing about 2 inches. So the pediment is inset by about the same amount. I would say quite a challange for the workers and high difficulty for the modeller. The inset soldier course to the buttresesss as jim, Has rightly pointed out could be done by inseting the soldiers into the underlying layer. To get the weathering edge on the lower edge is a challange but as this is probably about 1/2 an inch could either be the challange or left flush depending on the preference.

Could the decorative overlays be done from slaters plasticard instead of from the mdf. Though this might lose some of the deffinition in comparison to the mdf coursing... All rather large challenges but I must admit that the mdf version you have done is great. But then again I am a bit biased as I like your buildings any way.

Any way here is another question why do you think the concrete lintel was install rather than 2 arches at each end. Was it impact damage or something else?
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

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martinm
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby martinm » Sat Jun 22, 2013 2:04 pm

All very odd - the closer one looks, the more questions are raised.

The arched end shows some settlement damage, almost to the point of preventing the door from moving; the left arch support (concrete?) seems deeper than the right.

The loading platform has timber above and below. (The model entrance seems well low?)

I can see no sign of any alteration to the brickwork at the open end, even to the 'blues' either side, echoed by those on the corner at this end. Though in shade, I can't distinguish any at the door end.

Which end was the entry? The big opening or the doors?

I can just make out three trusses inside - one between each window, carried on the main piers.

Hope this helps, not hinders - laser cutting certainly seems a good way forward for this sort of thing.

martin

Tim Horn
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Tim Horn » Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:27 pm

Hi Martin, Doug,

Thanks for your interest :) As far as I'm aware, the shed has always been arched at one end only, the only difference I can tell in old photos is that the supporting hinge concrete bits were added sometime after the 1920's.

I can't find any photos online to link to, only in a few old books and photos, but the line ran into the concrete big opening and out just after the arches into a typical GER wooden bufferstop, about a vans length past the arches. The line was always single line working, and a rather nifty 3 way point lead off the mainline, one side into the station yard and back into the cattle dock, the other into a headshunt and then back into the goods shed.

One thing I've never been able to work out is there appears to be no support for an awning or canopy out of the side wall over the main doors. Perhaps it never had one? Also there appears to be no steps down as well, but I'm guessing that the concrete side entrance could be wide enough to have steps coming down from the platform inside?

One of the things I try to do when drawing is draw everything out in one layer. This enables me to see if everything lines up and saves me scratching my head much later as to where things go. You can see from the two drawings that I've drawn all the sides as one, then take each wall apart and form up the various layers which will be printed separately to build up a 3d wall.

I will try and draw in the settlement on the arch at a later point. This shouldn’t be too difficult to do when I know that the model works. Martin, the wooden beams will be excluded, although I've included the top one for now, as to me MDf dosen't look like wood. I'd rather use something similar like balsa as this is quite a key look to the model.

I've also made a first attempt at doing the apex brickwork. If you take a step back from the complexity of the photo, you can see that the wall and parts are quite simple once you have got your head around the main structure. The difficult bit for me is trying to decide what the main structure will be, and then work outwards or inwards with the various courses.

Hope this helps!

Cheers
Tim

Goods Shed Holme Hale 4mm Scale TJH01 23rd June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Goods Shed Holme Hale arch end TJH01 23rd June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Holme Hale goods shed Arch end print test TJH01 23rd June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Holme Hale goods shed Arch end print test TJH02 23rd June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Holme Hale goods shed Arch end print test TJH03 23rd June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg

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Mike Garwood
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Mike Garwood » Sun Jun 23, 2013 8:50 pm

Fantastic work Tim, really envious of this work.

Mike

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martinm
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby martinm » Sun Jun 23, 2013 10:50 pm

Tim,

"the supporting hinge concrete bits were added sometime after the 1920's" - could the beam at the entrance have also been wood, and replaced at the same time?

"there appears to be no support for an awning or canopy out of the side wall over the main doors" - I agree there is no sign, so it probably never had one. There were quite a few that did not, though I don't know what might have been the deciding factor.

The arch end "test" is awesome, especially when I think how difficult and time consuming it would be to make any other way!

Keep up the good work,

martin

DougN
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby DougN » Mon Jun 24, 2013 3:05 am

Tim, that is fantastic that you can get that level of definition in the MDF from the laser cutter. I am really impressed! I thought that the thickness of the MDF would not allow what you have done!

I know here in Australia it is difficult, to neigh on impossible, to find MDF under 3mm.
Doug
Still not doing enough modelling

Natalie Graham

Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Natalie Graham » Mon Jun 24, 2013 10:52 am

martinm wrote:All very odd - the closer one looks, the more questions are raised.


It is also interesting that the decorative courses are different at each end. I thought Tim had them wrong on his trial end until I realised that while those at the arched end are composed of courses of both headers and stretchers those at the other end are done entirely with headers. The end with the flat opening also has fewer decorative courses.
martinm wrote:I can see no sign of any alteration to the brickwork at the open end, even to the 'blues' either side, echoed by those on the corner at this end. Though in shade, I can't distinguish any at the door end.
It might only be down to the light but, to me, the bricks on the end with the lintel seem more red and less brown than on the other walls. Interestingly there are no blue bricks at any of the other corners or openings. Presumably they are there to protect the corners from wear (or repair worn corners?) so I wonder why they aren't also used, at least, at the side opening where one would expect they would also be subject to knocks and bumps.

I wonder, too, at the reasoning for the opening with the concrete lintel being wider than that at the other end. The arched opening does seem very tight to the loading gauge going by the model photo with a van in it, and the apparent lack of steps from platform level would have made it difficult to get in and out of the shed involving either a tight squeeze past a vehicle parked in the opening or a clamber up onto the platform. This, together with the different brickwork, makes me think that perhaps it originally had both ends the same but that the arched opening was found not to be large enough in use and the entire end was rebuilt very early on in the shed's life to give better access in and out for railway workers at the 'business' end, but it wasn't considered worth it at the end which only goes to the buffer stops. The bricklayer copied the decorative gable at the other end but in his own style.

On a modelling note I wasn't too impressed with the appearance of the laser-cut brickwork as the the joints seemed overly pronounced. That was until I scrolled up the page and saw the little shed once it had the mortar courses filled in. That really makes a big difference and the effect is very realistic.

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Will L
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Will L » Mon Jun 24, 2013 11:15 am

Tim Horn wrote: As far as I'm aware, the shed has always been arched at one end only, the only difference I can tell in old photos is that the supporting hinge concrete bits were added sometime after the 1920's.


I'm not so sure Tim. Not that it is of any more than academic interest, I think the whole square end has been rebuilt at some point.

1. I think you can see the joint between old and new up the middle of the end pillars.
2. The brick at that end is in better general repair than elsewhere
3. The string courses on the triangular section at the top is a lot simpler than at the arched end, and I can't see them building different detailed ends at the same time.
4. there remains one of the stone/concrete hinge blocks on the outside pillar at the square end
5. The blue brick ware patches at the lower end of the piers at the square end don't exist at the arched end and are most likely later addition.
6. And the concrete lintel at the square end is sitting on pads made of the same blue bricks.
7. I suspect the concrete lintel at the square end is just too modern for the building. The lintel over the side entrance appears to be wood.

I wasn't sure how well this was going to come out in the single layer version but I see the point now you've explained your thinking, and the full profile end is excellent. Remind me, how thick is the MDF you are using.

Will

Edited P.S. I didn't see Natalie's post until after I'd submitted mine. We seem to have come to much the same conclusions.
Last edited by Will L on Tue Jun 25, 2013 7:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Tim Horn
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Tim Horn » Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:03 pm

Hi All,

Many thanks for your thoughts and comments, greatly appreciated :)

One thing I've noticed in this linked photo, I've missed an inner arch, which would account for the door being able to open outwards but prevent it from going in on its self. http://www.flickr.com/photos/blue-pelic ... 530891606/

On closer inspection of my photo of the concrete beam end, you can see that the brick courses on the inner section to the left run out of line mid way down, this has got to be a rebuild job at some point and I would agree with Natalie and Will. I will have to do both ends arched and also as rebuilt. I think both ends arched would look very attractive.

The MDF used is 1mm, but I glue a .30mm backing of card onto it so that the interlocking bricks work without any effort. Bit of a pain, but even the 1mm stuff fluctuates a bit in thickness. Doug, it get it from http://maplestreet.co.uk , although its probably too heavy to send out to you, but someone may make some closer to home.

The mortar lines are a bit too deep; I’d just cleaned the mirrors again and hadn’t adjusted the power settings down so they burned away too much. It does look ok though once i’ve used wood filler as mortar paint. I’ve also used card for the other brickwork which works really well with cutting.

I’ve had a play around with the side entrance today, and apart from a few mistakes and some minor adjustments, it has come out ok. One of my aims is to have the interlocking work so that it’s easy to put the kit of bits together. The build time is only 20ish minutes so far, and most of that is waiting for the speed bond wood glue to go off :)

Martin and Mike, It’s about testing bits at the moment, and trying to find easy ways of doing the awkward bits and pieces so we can spend time dressing up the model.

Cheers
Tim

Holme Hale goods shed Loading Side print test TJH01 23rd June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Holme Hale goods shed Loading Side print test TJH03 23rd June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg


Holme Hale goods shed Loading Side print test TJH02 23rd June 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg

wally

Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby wally » Tue Jun 25, 2013 9:18 pm

I have been following the discussion on this building with interest and would like to make two comments which may give rise to a couple of tangents.

Firstly looking at Tims photo posted showing the detail of the top corner of the arched end there appears to be the top of a window in the blank arch which does not appear in any other picture, any ideas why?

Secondly regarding the lack of an awning on the side loading door, on many sheds there was a recess in the dock floor into which the cart could be reversed for partial loading under cover. Could this be the case here?

Wally

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grovenor-2685
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby grovenor-2685 » Tue Jun 25, 2013 9:45 pm

wally wrote:I have been following the discussion on this building with interest and would like to make two comments which may give rise to a couple of tangents.

Firstly looking at Tims photo posted showing the detail of the top corner of the arched end there appears to be the top of a window in the blank arch which does not appear in any other picture, any ideas why?

Going by the modern lamp and added downpipe I would suggest this is more recent than the other pics, ie after the conversion to a house that Tim mentioned.
Secondly regarding the lack of an awning on the side loading door, on many sheds there was a recess in the dock floor into which the cart could be reversed for partial loading under cover. Could this be the case here?

Wally

The picture showing the side door clearly shows the absence af any such cart entry, so I would say not.
Regards
Keith
Regards
Keith
Grovenor Sidings

Tim Horn
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Tim Horn » Tue Aug 13, 2013 6:00 pm

Time goes quickly doesn't it!

Had a few big jobs to get in the modelling way, but back on track now. I haven't had a chance to progress with the goods shed, but I've managed a spot of mortar testing on the old bridge. I've also got on with a few commissions which have been progressing nicely over the past week or so. Keeping things simple at the moment :)

I should point out that all the models are at a testing stage, and I take every opportunity to have a play at painting them up, so colours may not be correct :)

Cheers
Tim

GER bridge TJH01 12th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
GER bridge TJH01 12th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


GER bridge TJH02 12th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
GER bridge TJH02 12th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


GER bridge TJH03 12th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
GER bridge TJH03 12th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


Bromley North footbridge piers TJH01 12th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Bromley North footbridge piers TJH01 12th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


Bromley North footbridge piers TJH02 12th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Bromley North footbridge piers TJH02 12th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


Bromley North footbridge piers TJH03 12th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Bromley North footbridge piers TJH03 12th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


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Eastliegh Depot Mess Hut TJH01 5th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


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Mike Garwood
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Mike Garwood » Wed Aug 14, 2013 2:05 pm

Just keeps getting better...any chance of the files being made available? Cheeky I know, but if you don't ask you never know.

Mike

Tim Horn
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Tim Horn » Thu Aug 15, 2013 3:34 pm

Sorry Mike, but not for these ones.

Another work one today, one of the best things about copying brickwork brick for brick (with the aid of good photos) is that once you have got it all worked out and drawn, the model falls together :)

This one looks smart already, but it was a right pig to draw out the two door wall, with various sized bricks to line up and sort out.

First test print as well, so I'm pleased that it all fits.

Cheers
Tim

Bromley North Shunters Bothy TJH01 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Bromley North Shunters Bothy TJH01 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


Bromley North Shunters Bothy TJH02 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Bromley North Shunters Bothy TJH02 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


Bromley North Shunters Bothy TJH03 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Bromley North Shunters Bothy TJH03 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


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Bromley North Shunters Bothy TJH04 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn

Tim Horn
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Tim Horn » Thu Aug 15, 2013 8:04 pm

I've had a go with the 3D printer, although the resolution isn't up to much compared to Shapeways printed FUD stuff, I know that most of this is being covered or hidden with roof felt so I don't need to finish it off with filler.

Better get on with the windows next :)

Cheers
Tim

Bromley North Lamp Hut TJH01 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Laser cutting Bromley North Lamp Hut TJH01 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


Bromley North Lamp Hut TJH02 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Bromley North Lamp Hut TJH02 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


Bromley North Lamp Hut TJH03 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Bromley North Lamp Hut TJH03 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


Bromley North Shunters Bothy 3D printer TJH01 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Bromley North Shunters Bothy 3D printer TJH01 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


Bromley North Shunters Bothy TJH05 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Bromley North Shunters Bothy TJH05 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


Bromley North Shunters Bothy TJH06 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Bromley North Shunters Bothy TJH06 15th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


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Mike Garwood
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Mike Garwood » Thu Aug 15, 2013 10:13 pm

You can't blame a fella (who's jealous) from trying!

Wonderful stuff Tim, full of admiration for this.

Mike

Tim Horn
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Tim Horn » Mon Aug 19, 2013 6:38 pm

Thanks Mike :)

I've been messing with cills and windows this evening . .

Cruel close-up pic

Bromley North Lamp Hut cills TJH02 19th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Bromley North Lamp Hut cills TJH02 19th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn


Bromley North Lamp Hut cills TJH01 19th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn.jpg
Bromley North Lamp Hut cills TJH01 19th August 2013 Copyright Tim Horn

Lindsay G
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Re: GER (Norfolk) single arch under bridge

Postby Lindsay G » Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:53 pm

Pray tell how you messed about with the windows.

Lindsay


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