A little diversion...

Terry Bendall
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby Terry Bendall » Tue Nov 30, 2021 8:48 pm

Paul Willis wrote:the paint will tend to run under the template's edge through capillary action.


The same problem happens when drawing using a tubular type drawing pen or a bow pen. Many years ago when I used such things for engineering drawing the guide - be it a ruler, a set square or anything else had a bevel on one side so these were used with the bevel downwards which prevents the problem that Paul mentions. One solution for a template for lining is to make a spacing piece and glue it to the underside which will achieve the same effect. One way of holding the template in place is to use small bobs of Blu Tac or similar. I have some lining to do at some stage in the not too distant future where I plan to do it this way.

Terry Bendall

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John Donnelly
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby John Donnelly » Tue Nov 30, 2021 10:03 pm

Triode wrote:Sorry to hear that John. Sounds like it won't be an easy repair.


Fortunately, and surprisingly, it is just the one bogie, the chassis and body survived without damage. However, the bogies frames and brake gear are very much out of shape and a couple the resin axle boxes have broken.

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John Donnelly
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby John Donnelly » Sat Dec 18, 2021 9:30 pm

Another diversion, although still most definitely sticking with the North east theme.

As a predominantly diesel modeller, I've never actually built a loco with a coupled chassis and, whilst I do have a Bradwell 9F chassis to build, that doesn't seem like one to go for as a first build so I've opted for the High Level Models chassis for the Bachmann 03. Plan is to build it fully sprung as one of the 03s that used to hang around in the darkness at the back of Newcastle Central Station either 03170 or 03066.

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Paul Willis
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby Paul Willis » Sun Dec 19, 2021 8:03 am

Must be something about webmasters...

Nice choice of kit. You'll really enjoy putting that together.

Your illustrious predecessor, John McAleely, also built the High Level 03 as his first "proper" chassis kit :-)

https://www.scalefour.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=1333

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Paul
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Noel
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby Noel » Sun Dec 19, 2021 11:04 am

John Donnelly wrote:Plan is to build it fully sprung as one of the 03s that used to hang around in the darkness at the back of Newcastle Central Station either 03170 or 03066.


Don't forget the Conflat L runner that they always had to make sure they worked the TCs... :D
Regards
Noel

Daddyman
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby Daddyman » Sun Dec 19, 2021 3:58 pm

Noel wrote:
John Donnelly wrote:Plan is to build it fully sprung as one of the 03s that used to hang around in the darkness at the back of Newcastle Central Station either 03170 or 03066.


Don't forget the Conflat L runner that they always had to make sure they worked the TCs... :D

Not always?
https://table158photography.weebly.com/ ... p_2287.jpg

Porcy Mane
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby Porcy Mane » Sun Dec 19, 2021 5:08 pm

The coreless motor you've got there should make things a lot controllable with more space for a speaker.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qj8E3412Afw

P

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Hardwicke
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby Hardwicke » Sun Dec 19, 2021 6:18 pm

Daddyman wrote:
Noel wrote:
John Donnelly wrote:Plan is to build it fully sprung as one of the 03s that used to hang around in the darkness at the back of Newcastle Central Station either 03170 or 03066.


Don't forget the Conflat L runner that they always had to make sure they worked the TCs... :D

Not always?
https://table158photography.weebly.com/ ... p_2287.jpg

Just the thing. I built a Red Panda kit years ago.
Ordsall Road (BR(E)), Forge Mill Sidings (BR(M)), Kirkcliffe Coking Plant (BR(E)), Swanage (BR (S)) and Heaby (LMS/MR). Acquired Thorneywood (GNR). Still trying to "Keep the Balance".

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zebedeesknees
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby zebedeesknees » Sun Dec 19, 2021 6:24 pm

John Donnelly wrote:I've opted for the High Level Models chassis for the Bachmann 03. Plan is to build it fully sprung...

Hi John,
as it happens, I have one on the 'shelf' that I bought with the same intention. However, Chris's intention was that it should be rigid, or if one is so inclined, it can be compensated between the leading axles. After careful study of the diagrams and the etches, it went back on the shelf.

There is no option in the kit to allow the driven axle to move vertically, nor for the crank axle to actually drive the wheels. I am guessing that Chris decided that given that the flycranks were castings, there would need to be very accurate compliance with the crankthrows of the chosen wheelsets for the chassis to work successfully. The clue is in the inclusion of only two sets of axle bearings and guides.

It is not impossible! My 'Husky' drives the fly through the rods, and that is driven from the rear axle, even though the flycrank casting included the crankpin. That required some unconventional 'adjustments' to get it to run smoothly. But the flycrank castings in the 03/4 chassis look much better, needing the usual crankpins, though I haven't yet checked that the throw matches that of my wheels. In your pic, they are hiding in a plastic bag under some etches that I don't have in my kit. (duplicate pts 25/6?)

For fully sprung, assuming the throws match, a way of springing the rear axle needs to be devised. CSBs? My idea is to fit a gearbox (somehow!) to the crank axle, and avoid the designed drive system altogether.

Perhaps a new topic for this?

Ted.
(A purists' purist)

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John Donnelly
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby John Donnelly » Sun Dec 19, 2021 7:44 pm

zebedeesknees wrote:
John Donnelly wrote:I've opted for the High Level Models chassis for the Bachmann 03. Plan is to build it fully sprung...

Hi John,
as it happens, I have one on the 'shelf' that I bought with the same intention. However, Chris's intention was that it should be rigid, or if one is so inclined, it can be compensated between the leading axles. After careful study of the diagrams and the etches, it went back on the shelf.

There is no option in the kit to allow the driven axle to move vertically, nor for the crank axle to actually drive the wheels. I am guessing that Chris decided that given that the flycranks were castings, there would need to be very accurate compliance with the crankthrows of the chosen wheelsets for the chassis to work successfully. The clue is in the inclusion of only two sets of axle bearings and guides.

It is not impossible! My 'Husky' drives the fly through the rods, and that is driven from the rear axle, even though the flycrank casting included the crankpin. That required some unconventional 'adjustments' to get it to run smoothly. But the flycrank castings in the 03/4 chassis look much better, needing the usual crankpins, though I haven't yet checked that the throw matches that of my wheels. In your pic, they are hiding in a plastic bag under some etches that I don't have in my kit. (duplicate pts 25/6?)

For fully sprung, assuming the throws match, a way of springing the rear axle needs to be devised. CSBs? My idea is to fit a gearbox (somehow!) to the crank axle, and avoid the designed drive system altogether.

Perhaps a new topic for this?

Ted.


Thanks for that, very enlightening, I must admit I just assumed it could be built sprung :mrgreen:

Given that this will be my first chassis, I’ll stick to the instructions with regards to compensation…

John

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Re: A little diversion...

Postby Crepello » Sun Dec 19, 2021 10:24 pm

Yes, mine's on the shelf too, for the reasons Ted gives.
I'd thought it would make a nice straightforward project.

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John Donnelly
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby John Donnelly » Mon Dec 20, 2021 12:52 am

Made a start and the front steps are done...

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Paul Willis
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby Paul Willis » Mon Dec 20, 2021 10:28 am

John Donnelly wrote:Thanks for that, very enlightening, I must admit I just assumed it could be built sprung :mrgreen:

Given that this will be my first chassis, I’ll stick to the instructions with regards to compensation…

John


If you're Ted, these things can and have been sprung :-)

For us mere mortals, you will have very acceptable results just following Chris's design and instructions to the letter.

I've been down this road of "do I spring" three times now with Chris's kits, and I always come back to the same conclusion. And the resulting models run extremely well.

I'm looking forward to seeing how the build progresses. I have a feeling that you'll enjoy it!

Cheers
Paul
Beware of Trains - occasional modelling in progress!
www.5522models.co.uk

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Simon_S
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby Simon_S » Mon Dec 20, 2021 11:24 am

I'm building mine with springy equalising beams. There is a half-etched line around the 'fixed' axle hole to help you cut out the opening for hornguides if desired, you'll need Chris's slimline version. I temporarily fitted a top-hat bearing to the centre axle hole, cut out the front and rear hornguide slots and fixed their hornguides with reference to the centre axle, then cut out the centre slot and fixed its hornguide with reference to the outer axles.

The flycrank axle is gear driven and doesn't have crankpins, the rear section of the coupling rod is joined to the middle section and just hangs in mid-air.

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Will L
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby Will L » Mon Dec 20, 2021 11:52 am

The issue with springing some of Chris's kits is that they are very small and there is no room designed in round the motor. I'm thinking of the GER coffee pot kit here. So if you modify the chassis to allow the driving axle to move, you will find that you have just waisted your time. Guess how I know this. If, however, the kit comes with the hornguide hole half etched round the fixed axle, it is reasonable to expect that the design does allow sufficient room, and fitting CSBs (for instance) in the normal way shouldn't be any more of an issue than normal.

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Simon_S
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby Simon_S » Mon Dec 20, 2021 2:54 pm

A possible fly in the ointment for the 03 chassis is that the spur gear to drive the flycrank lies above the rear axle so will limit its upward travel. I think it will still provide a useful range of movement though.

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John Donnelly
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby John Donnelly » Mon Dec 20, 2021 8:10 pm

Rear steps built:

Image

Rivets punched out in the chassis frames:

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It's at this point that things came to a grinding halt as I need to ease out the holes for the bearings and, as I've never needed on before, I don't have a reamer to do this. One has been ordered and, while I'm waiting I figured I'd have a go at the coupling rods and here are both sets after soldering but with only the bottom one having had any cleanup as yet:

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John Donnelly
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby John Donnelly » Fri Dec 31, 2021 12:43 am

Straight from a wash to get rid of any flux residue, progress on the 03 chassis...

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John Donnelly
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby John Donnelly » Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:53 pm

A bit more progress on the chassis with part of the gear box mount added, some end stiffeners and brake hangers on the outside of the frames. Well outside of my comfort zone with some of the smaller parts wondering if other parts will fall off with the heat...

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Image

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Paul Willis
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby Paul Willis » Fri Dec 31, 2021 7:07 pm

John Donnelly wrote:A bit more progress on the chassis with part of the gear box mount added, some end stiffeners and brake hangers on the outside of the frames. Well outside of my comfort zone with some of the smaller parts wondering if other parts will fall off with the heat...


As it's all nickel silver so far, and Chris designs his kits extremely well, the probably answer is "no". Unless you're using really over the top amounts of heat through your iron, or lingering far too long with it.

If you're worried, you can always use a lower temperature solder for adding on the detail.

Don't worry - you're going great guns, and that all looks very neat. If you've seen my 48xx thread, there is a lot more stray solder marking the frames, etc.

Cheers
Paul
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John Donnelly
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby John Donnelly » Fri Dec 31, 2021 11:26 pm

Thanks Paul, nothing has fallen off so far so I may be worrying needlessly. Made a start on the gearbox tonight as well:

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John Donnelly
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby John Donnelly » Tue Jan 04, 2022 11:31 pm

A bit more progress on the 03 chassis, waiting to visit a friend who has a chassis jig before I solder the horn blocks in place for the centre and forward wheels:

Image

Coupling rods riveted, again, something I've never had to worry about before...

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John Donnelly
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby John Donnelly » Sat Jan 08, 2022 6:27 pm

A chance to make use of a friend's Avonside chassis jig has seen the horn blocks for the front two axles soldered in place:

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davebradwell
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby davebradwell » Sat Jan 08, 2022 7:37 pm

Probably too late for this one but a thought for the next, John - if you add bits of suitable tube to the intermediate gearbox shafts to prevent the faces of the gears rubbing together it actually reduces noise noticeably.

Yes, a very tidy job.

DaveB

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John Donnelly
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Re: A little diversion...

Postby John Donnelly » Sat Jan 08, 2022 7:47 pm

Thanks for that Dave, as it happens, the shafts are not currently fixed in place so I can still take it apart.


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